Thursday, April 6, 2017

Phoenix Preacher Becomes an Anglican

Why I am {Becoming} an Anglican.

Phoenix Preacher or Michael Newnham used to be a Calvary Chapel pastor.

His blog warned of many Calvary Chapel scandals after he left. He is now becoming an Anglican. Often over the years I have talked about how the deficiencies of evangelicalism lead some right back into the Catholic, and liturgical church system. One of his commenter's wrote; "I like my freedom way too much to be an Evangelical “christian” (small case on purpose). Well with all the Dominionism and authoritarianism shoved down people's throats on the religious right, I'm not going to argue with that guy. Phoenix Preacher [interesting name] is basically entering the left/liberal wing of the Catholic church. Anglican and Episcopal services which I have visited in my past, match, the Catholic mass very closely.

It is sad to read the comments and how many became fed up with the superficiality of false evangelical teachings and churches and how this led them right back into Rome's gaping maw. Religion is like politics, choose your side, "right or left", evangelical/Protestant or Catholic. Both the red and blue pill are poison. Us outliners who have left the system, it's hard I know. We have supposedly "invented our own religion" when all we did was get saved and actually read the Bible. It's sad to see thinkers fall for Rome's lies and false traditions over and over again.

Other mentions of Phoenix Preacher

40 comments:

Anonymous said...

Surprised that you knew of his blog. I have followed your blog for many years and I am not in the habit of posting comments but I find a lot of kinship with a lot of what you write. It does feel a bit lonely out there, not finding a church, have tried to congregate with people but they seemed too comfortable within the 501(c)1 system. I have read his blog here and there mostly to stay in touch with all things Calvary. One thing that I found very odd (among other things) is that he closed the comment section for an article that he did on Alex Joye Grenier, who had a very informative blog on Calvary Chapel mischief. A lot of people's red flag went up when Alex decided to abruptly close a blog that had much insight and information, specially in the comment section, of all that was going on in Calvary. I guess they don't want people to question their dealings. -Terry-

Bible Believer said...

Yeah they don't want people to question their dealings. I found his blog via Alex Grenier's blog. I didn't post about this, but the last thing I read on Alex Grenier is that he reconciled with his abusers.

https://spiritualsoundingboard.com/2017/02/03/update-from-alex-grenier-on-his-reconciliation-with-his-parents-who-sued-him/

Many do not understand how the seared work and draw people back in with false apologies and promises. I also found myself wondering how someone could give "forgiveness" to a seared would be sex abuser. I understand the forgiveness of "giving them to God" but to go back into relationship with them, it deeply bothered me. I know it's "his life" but it's like watching someone march right back into the Borg. I know I don't all these people or individuals, but wondered if the molested brother is in some kind of scapegoat status.

I wanted to throw up seeing the "we have reconciled" church celebration.

Maybe I have known too many malignant narcissists and sociopaths personally to know how religion and dysfunctional family dynamics work.

It just looks like more enabling of evil, and if the other brother really got molested and was not lying, he just massively got thrown under the bus.

Take it from someone who walked from/lost 30 relatives for daring to stand against abuse and evil from one sociopath. [and Yes hatred of biblical Christianity was a giant part of the picture] If someone wanted to throw a party, over me crawling back. I'd hand them a barf bag, turn away and slam the door. Hope no one here judges me for this, but I have paid in this life for not selling my soul to people far more then I have revealed here.

I always wondered about Alex anyhow. Got in a few debates with him. It's hard to know who to trust anymore.

Bible Believer said...

With Phoenix Preacher, I think Calvary Chapel serves as a "home to Rome" mechanism anyhow, maybe he's still taking orders? if not it sure seems like a launching pad for future Catholics and Anglicans, who want to replace the flowered tropical shirts and loose services, with Catholic "ancient traditions" because they "got bored". I know people who have left evangelicalism recently, Trump seems to have been an interesting dividing wedge and so many are running back to the mainline and liturgicals in disgust with the religious right.

Bible Believer said...

The Alex stuff actually ties into that article I wrote on enabling of evil in churches.

Some guy is an [accused] child abuser/sex molester, etc etc. It's happy time for him. The church is having a party. It's happy day for them. Where's the [supposed] victim? If the allegations are true, the victim is definitely ostracized for life from the entire family. That's how it works and the religious system loves the reconciliation with the most wicked stories.

Soldier of Jah said...

Michael Newnham and me have debated quite a bit. He is an angry man that has a warped view of church history. He makes excuses for Rome and their idolatry because he knows that if he admits that the Church of Rome has been the Whore of Babylon since 196 AD, then that legitimatizes the Protestant daughters. If you do a thorough study of Church history then you will discover that what much of Christendom practices and believes is downright pagan, everything from systematic theology, sunday sabbath, pagan holidays, veneration of the cross, the mystical conception of the Godhead in which Father, Son and Holy Spirit comprise one single indivisible substance which comes straight out of gnostisicm. The list goes on and on. The early Christians kept the Sabbath, the feast days, did not unclean meats and believed in One God the Father and that Jesus was His only preexistent divIne Son.

Anonymous said...

BB,

Don't know if I saw it on PhxPreacher or where, a while back (weeks/months), but Alex's brother basically got tired of it all, and reconciled with his parents. Alex took it pretty hard. It left him standing there all alone. ; his brother having left him high and dry, the brother he had been defending, after all this time.

It's news to me that Alex reconciled with his folks, but in light of his brother's change of heart, I kind of saw the cave-in coming. I swooned over the reversal for Alex. After all he'd done, and all that his fight involved for his brother's sake. Alex basically said his brother's reversal was the ultimate betrayal, and he admitted not even knowing what to believe anymore concerning his brother's story...

Heartbreaking.

Soldier of Jah said...

The early Church would call the Holy Spirit "the Prophetic Holy Spirit" and they didn't really create a system of theology to define it other than it was the Spirit of God and the Spirit of Christ (Romans 8)

The LORD is my Shepherd, I shall NOT want... said...

How evil!

Bible Believer said...

cave-ins are common. The [would be] malignant narcissists and sociopaths put the pressure on. I got offered two cars to come crawling back, remember how poor I am. Jesus talks about people giving up all the treasures of this world. Getting away and being away from the control of the wicked can cost real money and other things in this world.

In my case even several years later it is like they are laying in wait. I was just an object to them. There was never any apologies or attempts for true reconcilation, etc, well consciences are needed for that.

With most wicked families, the top dog sociopaths run the show, and they will pull out any stops to get those who escape back in line, the techniques run a wide range. I believe the present old automobile has kept running with repairs and prayer. The high status ones will turn poverty/loneliness/rejection of the group--entire or almost entire family networks will be cut off, if you displease the high power and status in a family and use all of the above to against the escapees and those who have fled. The societal pressures to "get back in line" are immense and in this case, these two took their fight public using real names, etc and into the courts even more so. They probably already got told they were "angry", "bitter" etc for not forgiving the [would be] "unrepentant" wicked. I only skimmed the surface with that "enabling of evil" article of the many psychological and other influence the wicked can have on people in the churches.

The cave-ins don't surprise me. I caved in at age 22 after three years out. [not a Christian yet and not knowledgeable how malignant narcissists, evil and others worked, I was only at "people of the lie" book know-how knowing I faced evil but not what to do about it--Biblically and otherwise] Problem is they are now vulnerable again.

People may call me cynical on this one, but I believe if someone abuses children [if these people were guilty of these charges] the conscience is already gone.[seared to a char] I don't mean one slap in the heat of anger or normal sins but systematic destruction of young human beings.

Soldier of Jah said...

Alex paid a heavy price for his crusade. I think he did the right thing in letting it go. Not necessarily the reconciliation with the offenders but moreso the reconciliation of his marriage. He seems happy again enjoying wife and kids. I support him.

Anonymous said...

I've debated with Michael many times over the years. He was always a strong proponent of the "lordship salvation" false gospel that leads to hell, which also came primarily from catholicism through its daughters calvinism and arminianism (Michael was a calvinist). So I made a comment on his anglican post that he is just taking the natural next step from the "lordship salvation" heresy to Rome. He's always been a fake, he was never a Bible believer. He was a "traditions of man" believer. -Jess

Anonymous said...

I believe the Anglican and episcopal church has had priests actually leave their church and join Druidic orders. There was a headline I read of at least 2 known people doing this. There was another that read that there were some that "repented" of their Druidic witchcraft. I'm thinking there was an Anglican priest in England who was a priest and Druid at the same time. Anglicans are basically Roman Catholics anyway, and have been for a long time.....James

Anonymous said...

@Soldier of Jah, I think that there are a great deal of people who are grateful for the stuff he exposed, too bad he had to go through what he went through and I'm glad that he is in a better place now. However, it really was a loss for the blog to be closed down there was a lot of information in the comment section, information that is now lost. The fact that the blog was closed down, suddenly, without prior explanation or heads-up, really raised more than one eyebrow. One of his lasts posts indicated how he was determined to continue with the lawsuit to the bitter end to get the truth out there, but I guess the fact that his brother recanted may have been too much for him to bear. Aside from his personal situation, the blog shed a lot of light on the dark nook and crannies of Calvary Chapel. Too bad it is no longer available.... -Terry-

Anonymous said...

How do we know if there was true reconciliation? It could have been just for publicity because his life was threatened if he did not put that out there. We don't know what arrangement was taken to orchestrate the reconciliation. Regarding this pastor turned "priest" Jesus doesn't have denominations as His church. He doesn't label us under a denomination or organization. We are called His bride, born again believers. He doesn't ordain and approve of man-made systems. Very sad when true believers affiliate themselves with a denomination or franchise.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous 6:21,

"We are called His bride, born again believers. He doesn't ordain and approve of man-mad systems. Very sad when true believers affiliate themselves with a denomination or franchise."

So true! The denominational churches say, "You are not saved unless you are a member of a church." Then we have denominations calling each other unsaved due to the tenants of their faith. Then we have believers who do not belong to the religious industrial complex, who have believed on the LORD Jesus Christ for salvation, apart from any kind of human work to earn it, who trust in Him as their one and only Shepherd.

It is these individuals the organized church hates, literally.

Anonymous said...

I once had someone accuse me of being in a religion of one. Olga

Anonymous said...

dear bible believer the anglican church have a history of freemasonry in its ranks and want things you don't agree with another voice blog.

Anonymous said...

"Tenants of faith" is a way to gauge if a person is truly saved. I don't believe Roman Catholics and most Lutherans are saved due to what they believe. I also don't believe "lordship Salvationists" are saved due to their "tenants of faith, they all have one crucial thing in common, they set out to establish their own rightousness, and they put their faith on these "tenants" instead of putting it solely on Jesus Christ, wether it's the "Eucharist", water baptism, or "repenting from your sins". It's all a works based salvation message and not the true gospel....James

KJVmom said...


this is so heartbreaking for me to read about; I was raised Episcopalian and trust me, the mainline churches with all these liturgies are no place for a true Christian; they are long apostate. I watched my former church, a low church, become more Catholic in the late 70's. Even my dad, raised Episcopalian as well but no Christian, commented unfavorably on some of the changes. Dear fellow believers, stay away from these churches and warn others; I know good churches are hard to find; I found one that does preach the Scripture, and speaks out against feminism and worldliness; a few do exist, but I don't blame those of you who can't find one . Perhaps there is a good reason why Jesus said, When two or three are gathered in my Name..."

Bible Believer said...

I hope Alex's own family is doing well. I don't know the details regarding his marriage. That may add another challenge if his wife was not supportive of his endeavors. I never like to see the wicked "win", and I believe one's best bet is to "flee the wicked" the bible tells us we are to shun those who support evil.

I agree Michael supported the gospel of works. I would see his blog, but did not agree with him theologically, he seemed like a mainstream church person [yes Calvinist] who was of the liturgical bent already years ago. I never saw him as a bible believer. he was of the "internet monk" flavor. That's another blog I knew of years ago.

Do the Anglican priests LEAVE and join the druids, there was one I posted on years ago who hung out with the Druids while being an Anglican priest. Rowan Williams? Was that the name. Let me look.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/wales/2172918.stm

I don't buy the excuses that this was a "Christian" ceremony. Yeah right...

Bible Believer said...

You are right James, Anglicans are basically Catholics, the left lateral wing of the RCC, the Masses are the same, been to their services before.

I am glad he exposed some of Calvary Chapel too and Alex as well, but sad to see the blogs shut down. It seems like Calvary Chapel exposure does get shut down a lot. I wonder why the brother recanted. We have no idea to know of the pressures they were put under. I still find the idea of a "reconciliation service" rather revolting. Some may think that is cynical, but just seems like "religious displays" to me and making sure people stay back in line. By the way, my family attempts to get me "back in line" even years down the line. I lost relationships with nieces and nephews etc leaving the Catholic church, before my final division with 90% of the family.

So I agree with the poster, we have no way to know if it is "true reconciliation". Wills and inheritances, don't know if this applies in this case, are used as bargaining chips. Money and power and connections can be used in all sorts of ways too. "Get back in line". I had a relative who had their guardianship seized and this was kept secret from most of the family. It wasn't me. By the way I am more physically disabled then the person who had their guardianship seized but I am married when offers far more legal protections. I am probably too familiar with the machinations of the wicked too, to "trust" these outcomes as well.

I agree about denominations. Many of us here are done with the church system. I know there are some still in it, who are being called out...Many are leaving the religious industrial complex. I agree the organized church does hate those people. I've talked to "pastors" and others online, they definitely are upset beyond belief. The spiritual divide is there.

I've been there too Olga, I was told I had "my own cult" with my membership of "one".
Sure freemasonry runs the show with the Anglicans, same for many of the denominations. I believe they are even in strong with the IFB. It's been revealed their numbers are high in the SBC.

Agree about works based salvation James. Those running to the sacraments of Rome, like this guy definitely are lost. I agree with KJV Mom, those churches are so far gone. Apostate beyond belief. Rituals, and rites, and defenses of everything in extreme liberalism. {homosexuality, etc} The Anglican church is like Unitarians with Catholic religious rituals.

Anonymous said...

James, very well said. The "lordship salvation" false gospel is what unites all these groups together. Lutheran, orthodox, anglican, catholic, ecumenical "evangelical", baptist... they're all posting together on Michael's site as "brothers and sisters". And what they all have in common, is works for salvation. They all just choose different works for salvation, and of course, working for salvation cannot save. -Jess

Bible Believer said...

Interesting way to put it Jess, I agree about the constant works. Yes they post online as brothers and sisters. They see themselves simply as different flavors, with a few different "traditions" but they do share that commonality. the left churches "work" for salvation via social justice, the liturgicals via Sacraments, Dominionism is "working for God's kingdom" here on earth basically so that scoops up the apostate Baptists into the net. Sure a few of them preach salvation by faith but then they ADD to it.

Anonymous said...

Well, to everyone on this comment thread, you can be sure Michael Newham read your comments (or was at least made aware of them) and made them part of his latest blog post. -Terry-

Bible Believer said...

Thanks Terry.

What's an ODM by the way?

Bible Believer said...

It's ironic how they always go to the "classist" insults, "They are just a bunch of hillbillies".

Doesn't the guy realize I am an ex-Catholic I spent YEARS reading all those early church fathers, his one commenter loves. In Catholic school the study of Augustine, is mandated, but I took things further, add in endless Catholic contemplatives. The roots of the Anglican church are in Henry VIII, who executed two wives and not a out standing star of morality. He tries to pass off Anglican churches as holding evangelical ideals, well there's been the Emergent conglomerates, but realize the Anglicans follow the same order of service of the Catholic Mass.

I know the "no church" decision is hard but what is running from the stew pot into the fire going to do? Well arguing with those folks is a moot point. I know someone else personally who went from an apostate NAR church back to the Anglicans. What is ironic is most other Anglicans/Episcopalians I know, hold VERY ecumenical and liberal ideas, some are just a few steps away from out and out Unitarian Universalists when it comes to other religions. Perhaps Anglicanism is seen as the compromise, in not having to cope Vatican heavy-handedness and scandals.

Bible Believer said...

Oh "online discernment ministry"....

How many of those are left? I can think of 3 or 4 that may still be up. So many quit. It's not easy doing this. Most people probably clear out. I feel like the last hold-out. I thought of putting this blog on read only, hiatus, etc, but then something drives me to keep writing here.

Yeah I have questioned myself lately a LOT. I wonder if I have done things wrong myself, and question what I do. Since I left the IFB and saw that spiritual abuser for what they were, things have changed for me. I find myself asking "Why do all these people take the easy way out?" One church is rotten and corrupt and they go and choose another "team" that is even worse.
continuing

Bible Believer said...


Because I "have no chose" a side, and "conformed" life has been more painful. I don't see myself as more holy or special, but I find myself asking in my mind, "Are you even reading the same Bible I am?

This man's life will be far easier, he will leave the rightist caccoon for a leftist caccoon. Choose a pill, red or blue. See how easy that is? Who am I to tell anyone what to believe? I am no one. These kind of people will make you feel like you are the insane one, or the STUPID one.

However these church sell-out tales nauseate me. Some guy goes running from the right wing Dominionist Calvary Chapelists to the pro-homosexuality, shared Muslim/interfaith services of the Anglican church, and gets patted on the back. Yeah some may think it is insanity but there's so few out there now, who question the church system.

Yeah I know writing wise, I have not kept up though I am trying. I have had some feelings of despair about these many matters, and it has affected me spiritually as I have been facing some spiritual challenges lately. On here, I have to be careful to express these musings, as some will say, the root of the problem is my unchurched status, and I have "not conformed". They want me back in apostate camp worshipping a wafer.

These guys can take their mainstream "easy" way out and the majority of the world will pat them on the back. Revelation 17 means nothing I guess. Supposedly it's all those Muslims at fault, the church world is pristine {barf], the church world is more interested in murdering via their endless Plan for a New American Century wars as their loved politician Trump starts to get more new wars, going. Did you all know that MOAB Bomb which probably blew up 180,000 people in one fell swoop has lung bursting properties and basically blows up an entire square mile? Think about that. I know of Tornadoes that have been an entire mile in width, they have taken out entire towns. If a bomb of that size was dropped here, most of my entire town would vaporize. I am the only "Christian" I have ever seen even asking online, "Why do all these churches support the endless wars to murder all these people?" Oh sure, they are the "holy ones" under persecution, or something like that.

Do these people realize going to join the "established" group, is the easy way out? They can say with pride, "I am an Anglican". Henry VIII and all, and that guy who hung out with the Druids, Rowan Williams. There's many a little less cognitive dissonance, being a leftist step over from the Vatican puzzle palace. Of course I think an Anglican is just Unitarian Universalist [they do see all religions as going to the same place] with a Catholic Mass. United Church of Christ, is kind of over on that wing too, and Presbyterian USA. I think most of the churches will die with the Baby Boomers, Gen X and the millennials, need to sleep in from their slave jobs, and have nothing to put in the church basket. The college bubble is bursting and a church one will be coming soon too.

I remember 10 years ago, there was a LOT more ODMS. Where are the rest? I think most gave up. In a sea of conformity, coming out as the person to say "Something is wrong here" is not easy.

None of you have to worry about me ever selling out to the Anglicans or Catholic church. I may as well be a Unitarian Universalist again or an atheist. It's not that much far from it.

[I know I got long and wordy here, but hey why not be blunt......]

Anonymous said...

I was wondering what ODM means myself. I know what your mean about sites like yours disappearing, it is an arduous task and I cannot fathom how much time and effort it must take to compile an article let alone put up with online discussions that take a turn for the worst. I wonder if that is why Mr. William Sanders' various sites are no longer available, I know that it was difficult for him to attempt to rebuild after Youtube took his account down. I did speak with him on some occasions via Facebook, I found that we saw eye-to-eye on a lot of subject and then puff, gone. It has been years since I attended a "church" and sometimes entertain the idea of checking one out, but I've come to the conclusion that those places are nothing but centers for thought control and to keep everyone in toe with the party line.... in the name of Jesus of course. -Terry-

Bible Believer said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Bible Believer said...

Yes there's very few out there now. Independent ones, even far less. I have saw many come and go. I can understand why people quit doing this, seriously I can.I have had my own thought and doubts about continuing. I know my postings have slowed down considerably and I don't do the heavier research of years ago. I've been sick for years but my energy gets more and more limited. Maybe slower is better then nothing....there's very few websites that discuss these issues. Phoenix Preacher may go on about those dastardly ODMs being a problem, but they have fallen away like dominoes especially the true independent ones. I get the feeling even sounding the warning siren-call has fallen out of vogue too. I am no prophet or guru, and sometimes I ask "Who am I to even post about these things?" The pressure to conform can come via that direction too, the one world church is already using these things, that to stand outside it means you are the "nut", the "crazy" and even this one, "to stand outside the churches" means you are not a Christian at all. PP's path into wafer worship will mean "acceptance" in this world. Sometimes I have felt "burdened" by the things I found out and wrote about here for years, was some happiness lost not being in a church with people who loved and cared about me? Did I ask too many questions, think too much? Funny I state it that way, I know. I'm not perfect. Some ripped on me for thinking I was the "worlds" best Christian" or "too pure" for church but I never saw it that way. I knew I was far from perfect but I never could shut down my mind or what I had learned via God's Word, and "get with the program" they wanted me to get with. I saw full blown evil, like that church where the guy praised killing people in another country overseas.

Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.

continuing...

Bible Believer said...


This blog recently hit 3 million plus views last year so some have read what I had to write here at least and I was glad to warn about things and hope I helped some people and to feel less isolated and not feel so crazy about knowing via scripture what they saw going on, but I have had my own spiritual struggles lately and turmoil too impacting things.

I won't judge any who have quit. The pressures can be immense. One thing that grinds you down, is the immensity of all the deception and then also dealing with your own faults all at the same time. You can take heat for years. I did. I had a lot of complaint mail especially the first 5 years.

I believe life is easier for people in the churches. They are happier and untroubled but what of the spiritual blindness? Sometimes lately I have questioned myself about my efforts for this blog, was it worth it? I felt driven to warn about somethings. I am glad I did, and don't regret it, but some of my angst has grown. I had a weird conversation with my husband about how my exposure of what's wrong in Christianity has been a challenge, since so much is wrong, with the war lust, the authoritarianism, the evils I have seen, if not for the warnings in scripture about a false church system, it would all be beyond overwhelming. There is grief there, though our enemies would never suspect that, they don't realize we have thoughts about what should be and what the reality of "church life" has become. My own experience with spiritual abuses too have come to the fore.

This blog kind of is ignored now due to age, and the slowing down of the writing but earlier days, I was never left alone, got scary emails, and then trojans etc, lots of online discussions that went south, some weird alternative theologians here showing up to steer conversation. It gets tiring. We have our own lives to live and to deal with.

Also being just an average human myself the task feels too great. While you know and hold beliefs, you have examined for years about where churches have gone, being outside the church system in some ways is getting harder. The isolation is hard. The feeling of no one else believing this way has grown only stronger for me, when it comes to real life. Some people told me I have founded my own religion on this website, some time ago. I never wanted to do that, but it brings a lot of questions.

I am troubled lately that I seem able to talk to non-believers easier then the "Christian" set who have been so brainwashed, and follow lock step, and are more and more alike everyday.

I have your same thoughts, about checking one churches, but I was out for 6 years after leaving the Calvary Chapel I visited for a time after moving and then there was the second IFB that went so badly. I feel like the thought control is even worse. The first IFB I was talking to husband, we were at least allowed to talk to each other somewhat but I had a very young beginning pastor then.

So I understand why the people go poof. I've been doing this 7 years now. That's a long time, before then even I was examining and exposing the interfaith movement in the Catholic church which I was leaving or just left on message boards.

I've seen many of the disaffected evangelicals go back to conforming, and doing what the priests want them to. That's nothing new either. I know people don't want to be alone, but I guess truth doesn't matter to them.. If they became evangelical in the first place, I guess no one told them about that salvation via grace vs salvation vs. faith basic.

Bible Believer said...

correction to above, Salvation vs faith, should be salvation via works basic....

Anonymous said...

Well Bible Believer, no one can ask you to keep doing this forever but I will say that your site does feel like a last bastion for this information. Should you ever stop writing, I hope you keep the site up it can serve as a springboard for some or corroborate certain issues for others. I never realized how helpful Mr. Sander's site was until he no longer had any of it available. I've asked myself similar questions, I know I'm not perfect, not by a long shot, but I do my best to make sure that what I believe is based on the Word. -Terry-

Bible Believer said...

Thanks Terry, I appreciate it. I miss a lot of websites that have been removed or gone under. Sanders had a lot of Calvary Chapel stuff exposed and now with other websites being removed, well, the information is far harder to find. Thanks for understanding the questions. When one is out of the whole Christian industrial matrix, our validation comes via the Word and God. There's no mystery why the false churches lower the importance of scripture for the "traditions of men".

Anonymous said...

"There's no mystery why the false churches lower the importance of scripture for the 'traditions of men'."

Truer words could not be spoken. I wish I didn't but I still feel burn left by the member's of the church I last attended years ago. I basically followed the whole Matt. 18 with the "pastor" and his wife because they were beginning to veer into the whole "faith healing" (which they did anyways) and doing this quickly got me labeled as persona non grata and was ousted shortly thereafter. It also didn't help that one of the congregants lied by implying that I wanted to usurp the authority of the church head honcho. I am still baffled by the fact that "church" people claim to believe the Bible but still embrace false doctrines such as the one mentioned above.... -Terry-

Bible Believer said...

Thank you. All of them center around lowering the important of God's Word

Over on PP's website, he was outraged I called him ecumenical and started quoting "creeds". Well even demons admit God is real. Creeds mislead so many.

Sorry you tried to speak out against faith healing and were suppressed, the religious charlatans probably wanted money Terry. That is some of the worse stuff to come into a church.

Anonymous said...

Michael wrote an article about ecumenicalism, and he missed the point (intentionally). Yes, everyone says that the Trinity is true and that Jesus died for our sins and rose again. BUT, the issue is how to get into heaven. The Bible says by believing in Jesus with no works (Romans 4:5). Michael and his false religions are trying to get to heaven by works. - Jess

Bible Believer said...

Jess I agree it's all works, saying Jesus is "real" is not believing unto Him and being born again. It is not saving faith. Creeds have no saving faith to them. Yes, He missed the point entirely. Sad to say the evangelical world has gone so off the rails, we probably are going to see more of these back to liturgical churches "conversions".

Anonymous said...

I've come to think that Mr. Newham is a gatekeeper for the church system that exists. Yes, he will expose certain evils within but from my perspective will never actually address the root of the problem. I'm sure he missed the point on purpose. @BB; yes, they diminish and twist the meaning all the while saying they are doing the exact opposite. Mind boggling but it's true... -Terry-