Tuesday, July 23, 2013

Kirk Cameron's Movie: Unstoppable



I find myself thinking his answer to this question especially since he has teamed up with Liberty University will be wrong given the below.
“That’s one of the questions that wrecks people’s faith, that’s a question that turns Christians into atheists, it’s one of the big hand grenades that unbelievers like to throw at communities of faith,” he said. “I’m looking to answer this by taking you on a journey, back through the Garden of Eden to the creation of Adam and Eve and the fall … all the way through to Israel, Christ, and the destruction of the temple in A.D. 70, to show that all kinds of tragedies have taken place in the plan of God and He steers that tragedy and uses it to accomplish what He loves and ultimately restore all things back to Himself.”
I've talked about this a bit before, where I point out that too many believe the "bad things" that happened are produced via God. There are evil things that happen in this world, via sin or even the sins of others, or even death that came into the world via sin.

Romans 5:12 - Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

By the way there is a little funny theology there in the line " ultimately restore all things back to Himself". What about those who end up in hell?


  Jeremiah 29:11 is one of those verses, that the Bible versions, really CHANGED. The false version of this verse is abused all over the place. Let's read the KJV verse and notice the words in YELLOW.

Jeremiah 29:11-13 King James Version (KJV)

11 For I know the thoughts that I think toward you, saith the Lord, thoughts of peace, and not of evil, to give you an expected end.

12 Then shall ye call upon me, and ye shall go and pray unto me, and I will hearken unto you. 13 And ye shall seek me, and find me, when ye shall search for me with all your heart.


Do you notice the difference here? Do you see the change even in the meaning here?


Can you see how the BEST LIFE NOW "Christians" could skew this?




I haven't seen this movie yet, but since he is planning to explain the reasons for tragedies, and since he is already speaking of PLANS for THIS LIFE, something bothers me, about it all.

How many have been trained to see tragedies, evil, death happening in this world as part of GOD'S PLAN?

Don't get me wrong, I believe God can use evil for good. And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose (Romans 8:28 KJV).

But how many are being given this false message? Do you agree with me it's false? Do you see how I think this is being abused? The whole "PLAN" thing bothers me. If people are told that God has extraordinary plans for them in THIS LIFE, how many will fall away when facing the hardships of this world?

Will Kirk Cameron in this movie tell people God is not the author of evil, and that sin brought death and suffering to this world or will he tell them God has a great "plan" for their life here on earth?

I suppose I will have to watch the movie, but wanted to say something about all this PLAN stuff.

There was controversy about Facebook and Youtube censoring his movie but it was later blamed on a glitch.


45 comments:

Anonymous said...

Right out of the gate it is a question with a wrong assumption, "Why does God let bad things happen to good people". There are no good people, Matthew 19:17 and that is why bad things happen. God's plan was for us to walk with Him sinlessly in the garden forever. We blew it, we let Him down not the other way around. God sent His Son, Jesus Christ, to prove it. You are right about Liberty University. I will admit my wife and I did like "Fireproof" and we will probably watch this one. We all need other believers help and so we are given Proverbs 11:14. - Don

Anonymous said...

Kirk Cameron's theology is calvinistic. A theology that God is so "sovereign" that nobody has any free will at all, and so according to them, God causes all disasters and pain. They are a heretical group that are basically saying that God is the author of even sin.

Anonymous said...

Right out of the gate, I bet if you actually watch this, Both of you might be (BB and Don)surprised by an answer that is quite different than you have assumed. ;) And not only that perhaps find that you actually agree. (based on what I have heard of this former atheist before when he answered this)

Proverbs 18:13 He that answereth a matter before he heareth it, it is folly and shame unto him.

I've done that a few times more than a few myself...
Signed,
Guilty

FaithGuy3 said...

I don't plan to see this movie, but nonetheless Cameron himself has shown to have doctrinal errors over the years.

His last movie "Monumental" quietly promoted Freemasonry in a good light. I don't expect anything less from his "Unstoppable".

As for this whole "Why is there so much suffering in this world?" debates you hear in the modern-day, organized church system? Ultimately, the organized church system ends up throwing up more questions rather than godly edifying in the faith over what's in the holy scriptures, which is why so much confusion abounds over this in those church buildings.

Again, READ the scriptures and ask the Holy Spirit for guidance, instead of listening to these reprobates!

Anonymous said...

Here is a short list of things I never knew before I heard them from Kirk Cameron and Ray Comfort.

Don't be confused... He Teaches that...
There are no good people, only One good Saviour.
Bad things happen to "good people" because of sin in the world and sin they commit.

God's "wonderful plan for your life" is that you repent and turn 180 degrees from sin and believe the gospel with the same kind of faith that separates between merely knowing a parachute can save you but leave if off, and actually strapping it on.

You will face suffering as a Christian, but instead of adding a little Jesus to your life to improve your life, you cling to Him because you know without Him you face the eternal wrath of God. Cling to Him!

Here are some things he will not include as something to help you get saved...
You won't hear a word about Calvin.
You won't hear a word about Liberty University.
You won't hear a doctrinal thesis.
You won't hear -- "say the magic prayer"
You won't hear "raise your hand"
You won't hear "come up front"
You won't hear "go to this church or that church."
You won't hear "send me money".
He speaks against all of that.

You will hear "read your Bible."

I don't mean to be a spoiler and wreck your hate in...
But seriously he reaches thousands upon thousands with the Gospel.
It makes me wonder if any of you ever heard him at all?

I beg you to listen to him before you slam and slam at him.

Rom 14:4 Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.

I'm not 100% endorsing him (or anyone) but what I see here said of him is not right, and what you say here sounds like what I hear lost people and atheist and agnostics and such say of him.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rncnhmzfpwo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kmcKRxmwCks

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEUPcK6hi4s

Now where do you send those people you witness to that get saved?

Great theologian? naw.
Doing as much as he is able to preach the gospel? yeah.

They go places that have lost people, and they preach the gospel, those places include false churches false converts false theologians false universities... they don't seem to care how lost or what kind of lost they are preaching to, just lost people that Jesus died for, shed His blood for, and commanded believers to go and preach the gospel to!

The world is full of false teachers and preachers and churches so lost people are found there too. Don't expect a theological perfection from Kirk C, but as far as I can tell, NO ONE HAS ATTAINED IT. We rest in Christ by His Spirit.

Now if you want to bloody Kirk C's nose and break his fingers, at least have the decency to have an accurate accusation worthy of condemnation. To do that... you are going to have to start with what the Gospel is and is not, because that is his focus and your burden of proof is to discredit the Gospel he preaches and inject the Gospel you preach and tell us why "a" is right and "b" is wrong.

In other words...
You have to start by listening fairly to the gospel he preaches, and understand it, before you can cast the first stone.


Revelation 19:10
And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

Anonymous said...

More than likely the answer in the film will be that God is not dealing with sin today because He is waiting for all who will repent to come, 1 Timothy 2:4....and @ Guilty, Romans 12:18 - Don

Anonymous said...

Ray Comfort is a false teacher that teaches the false gospel of "lordship salvation". He is a calvinist that also joins up with false teachers like Joyce Meyer and Bill Gothard. Ray Comfort and Kirk Cameron are both false teachers reaching nobody with the true Gospel of Jesus Christ, since they don't preach it.

Bible Believer said...

Anon, Regarding Kirk Cameron and Ray Comfort...

There are a lot of problems there, and false ecumenical and other ties including with Kirk Cameron to Dominionism and Vision Forum.

I don't go by the test regarding religious teachers, "do they teach a basic gospel well?" There is far more then that and even in that realm I believe both have entered into the "easy believism" territory. Even false Pentecostals and others may present a basic salvation message while infusing endless other errors. That is one misnomer out there that anyone who can teach a basic salvation gospel message is a true teacher, I don't buy this. Sure God can use this for good, a few who watched Way of the Master may have gone on to truly be born again but it doesn't excuse the underlying agendas.

CONNECTED TO VISION FORUM

http://galatiansfour.blogspot.com/2011/08/ray-comfort-and-doug-philips-of-vision.html

COURAGEOUS [KIRK CAMERON] THE MOVIE'S LINKS TO RECONSTRUCTIONISM

KIRK CAMERON WITH DOUG PHILLIPS

http://galatiansfour.blogspot.com/2011/08/ray-comfort-and-doug-philips-of-vision.html

KIRK CAMERON SPEAKS with right side of the NWO CPAC

PRAISE for MASONIC MONUMENTS

http://galatiansfour.blogspot.com/2012/02/variety-of-links-7.html

Ray Comfort's Connections to Gothard

http://galatiansfour.blogspot.com/2012/09/ray-comforts-connections-to-gothard-and.html

There have been ecumenical ties with both including Ray Comfort who has even done conferences with Word of Faith types and of course their "start" with TBN, Kirk Cameron used to be recorded at their studios.



Bible Believer said...

I used to watch Way of the Master when I was a new Christian too. So I am quite familiar with Kirk Cameron and Ray Comfort. I agree with anon, they do go on the Calvinist edge with the "sovereign" thing

Realize Cameron looks for the Dominionist kingdom of THIS WORLD.

CULTURE CHANGERS, its right on the front banner on this video...

Christian Triumphalism at it's peak with this one...

With Cameron, I haven't figured out if he is a knowing deceiver or merely duped and "used" around all the religious "authorities" around him.

Bible Believer said...

I'll have to watch the movie later and tell you what I think.

Don [first anon] I agree about that statement you always hear, "Why does God let bad things happen to good people?" You are right there are no good people.

Bible Believer said...

Oops forgot to post video link above..

http://vimeo.com/37777945

One line in here struck me he refers to "THE CHRIST ON THE THRONE"

Think about that one.

Bible Believer said...

The false gospel thing...

I would go with that, when I talk about basic gospel messages, sure there are many teachers who are mention the name Jesus and say you must be saved, but they often have a lot of baggage.

I found the Way of the Master gospel FORMULAIC, they had this SYSTEM they used with the unbelievers and whenever anything is SYSTEMIC watch out. They'd run down the whole list of the 10 commandments, and ask the nonbeliever if they ever told a lie, stole a pencil from work, that sort of thing and told them they were lost and sure they were but it was like they were telling people there was guaranteed results, if we get all those nonbelievers to just "look at their long list of sins". Problem is conviction comes via the Holy Spirit, and well while I certainly am not a Calvinist, formulas aren't going to bring people to salvation. If you have someone say a sinner's prayer, what happens inside is what matters not the "formula", this is what I am driving at. I believe repentance and conviction comes via the Holy Spirit too, as a FRUIT of SALVATION, course I don't want to quibble this to death, but overall the Way of the Master stuff was FORMULAIC to the max. Telling nonbelievers if they are sorry for their sins, they will be saved, is false, they need to believe in Jesus Christ. Even the majority of lost people have some conscience [the ones who are not seared] where they will feel sorry for their sins. I hope I am explaining this well.

Anonymous said...

"They'd run down the whole list of the 10 commandments"

And that was the foolishness of Comfort's and Cameron's "system" is that it claims this is the only way to preach.

But if that was the only way to preach, then Jesus didn't know about it. Jesus spoke OT prophecies to Nicodemus in John 3, fulfillment of having eternal life to the woman at the well in John 4, a miracle to leap to the Gospel in John 5, and Himself as the Bread of Life in John 6. In none of those instances did Jesus run down the 10 commandments.

So Ray Comfort is wrong, wrong about his false gospel of works, and wrong about his "system".

As for the sinner's prayer, the thing is, if the person believes in the Gospel of Jesus Christ and prays to confirm it, there's nothing wrong with that. It's always prideful calvinists that think there is something wrong with prayer.

Anonymous said...

I think perhaps the main problem with Cameron and Comfort is not so much the specific problems stated earlier in the comments above, but the UNDERLYING problem that has generated those views and bents. What is that problem? Humanism.

"The end of all being is the happiness of man.."?
No.

"The end of all being is THE GLORY OF GOD."

It was the glory of God that drove millions to oppose the machine of the Vatican and drench the earth with blood during the 830+ years of the inquisition. Officially the inquisition died. Unofficially the inquisition continued underground. Not only did the Children of God have unbending faith to stave off doctrinal and behavioral compromise in their walk before God, but they had enough backbone to do REAL evangelism of the lost world around them when the cost of doing so meant becoming a casualty to the newest form of an ignominious and barbarous death the demon-possessed pope was itching to try out on the Vatican's heretics.

If Christianity is about God's grace being the means to bring about the ultimate happiness of man, even if sin is said to be the ruin of that, it's a Christianity that is STILL not found in the pages of the Word of God. If this kind of Christianity focuses mostly on the plan of this life and ignores the plan of eternity, then it is not a Christianity of the Bible.

God shares His glory with no one. He invested all worthiness and worshipfulness in His Son. If men fail to see that Salvation is for the GLORY OF GOD, not for the happiness of men, they fail to know Biblical Salvation and fail to have any proper fear of God. Without the fear of God, there is no Godly wisdom; without Godly wisdom, one is left with the wisdom of the world which is sensual and devilish.

I reference one of the greatest messages of all time, and it's found on Youtube, called "Ten Shekels and a Shirt" by Paris Reidhead. It is a must-hear!!

Anonymous said...

So far NONE of you have presented any Gospel, let alone explain the Gospel Kirk C and Ray Comfort preach.

So far NONE of you have even cast an accurate accusation against what they do preach.

You are all guilty of misrepresenting these preachers of the Gospel, and yet have no gospel to present yourself.

They don't preach works salvation at all.

I think the devil doesn't want you to hear the Gospel they preach. It sure sounds like he has succeeded.

Did any one of you look at even one of the links I posted? Or go to http://www.wayofthemaster.com and listen for yourself again?

I dare any one of you to refute the Gospel they preach with the Gospel you preach.

We have nothing without the Gospel. I don't care how many demons you can count....

If you're saved...
1 John 4:4
Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

Come on! Take the challenge to listen to them before you try to gut them.

Anonymous said...

Hey anon July 24, 2013 at 4:46 PM, The first time I heard that Paris Reidhead sermon was from a suggestion at one of the Way of the Master web sites. It's a good sermon.

I didn't notice you using the name of Jesus Christ nor The Lord Jesus Christ once in your Gospel (if that is what you were presenting), why not?

There are lots of flavors of what "Christianity" is not, There are many religions who worship a Son. There are many religions who feel they are following "godly wisdom".

Got Gospel?

Be fair... if you are going to rail against Cameron and Comfort, at least give a verifiable reason. What you accuse is not accurate. They don't preach the happiness of man.

Come on, at least listen to them before you drag them through the mud.

Sarah said...

Anonymous, you wrote "I didn't notice you using the name of Jesus Christ nor The Lord Jesus Christ once in your Gospel (if that is what you were presenting), why not?" Are you serious??? What is your point? Are you THAT hellbent on looking for error on anyone who opposes Cameron or Comfort? I am guessing you are Calvinist if your are getting THAT bent out of shape to defend Cameron and Comfort.

Anonymous said...

Comfort and Cameron are false teachers that have a false gospel that is accursed (Galatians 1:6-9), because they both teach works for salvation via the "lordship salvation" false gospel that leads to hell.

Here is the true Gospel:

Jesus Christ is God (John 1:1) who died for our sins and rose again (1 Corinthians 15:3-4) and whosoever believes in Jesus Christ as Savior, has eternal life (John 3:16) since believing in Jesus as Savior means agreeing that He paid for your sins (Acts 10:43). Thus we are saved by faith in Jesus, not works (Romans 4:5).

That is the true Gospel of Jesus Christ.

Anonymous said...

Hi Sarah,
Thank you for reading what I wrote :)

I'm not a Calvinist.
I'm not a Baptist.
I'm not a Calvary Chapelite,
I'm not a Catholic
I'm not a Protestant (AKA child/sister church of the RCC...)

I'm actually denomination agnostic. ;)

Hell bent...
Well if you want to know if I want people the hear the Gospel, then I guess you could say I am bent on keeping people out of hell.

Since I asked a any one of you to present the Gospel, and no one has yet, but you get all upset cuz I asked, to the point of casting more stones ...

I am certain that something is very wrong with this picture.

Casting accusations is not preaching the Gospel.

Here you go, you can here right from Ray what he thinks about the "wonderful plan stuff"

only 1 minutes long... will you spend 1 minute to hear for yourself?

http://youtu.be/tBTEZTIf9qY

Mrs. BB,
I spend hours reading your stuff here.
Won't you spend a couple of minutes looking at this again?

Now my other friends, you can also hear in the first 5 minutes of this video what he thinks about works righteousness...
http://youtu.be/Tn1_ntvZzsM

Here is the point.
I spent 25 something years thinking I was saved. And wasn't. Despite what hangups you or I have with his "method" or "theology", I hope you will actually hear and understand the Gospel they preach.

I know you haven't heard it because of what you are accusing them of.

Your enemy the devil really doesn't want you to hear this. Please chase him off, what have you got to lose?

Go listen!!!







Anonymous said...

Ray Comfort is a false teacher that teaches works for salvation. He doesn't teach the true Gospel of Jesus Christ. He also joins up with false teachers like Joyce Meyer. 3Stay away from him.

Anonymous said...

Hey, I don't know why I didn't go here first, but...

http://wayofthemaster.com/videolessons.shtml

That one link has several videos that have the answer to the objections you have brought up.

Don, BB, FaithGuy, the Anon's and Sarah

Start at the Top and listen to Hell's Best Kept Secret, it isn't about hell.

Since the others claim works salvation or God's wonderful Plan... go to the video with that title next.

Please?
Will you please watch those?

Bible Believer said...

Hey I watched endless Ways of the Master, I even have read acouple books by Comfort, but problem is, why do they both hang around false teachers? Where is their discernment about the Word of Faithers, the Dominionist, Doug Philips and Gothard who preach false legalistic gospels of their own? What gets me is you see webwide, people discussing Cameron and Comforts associations, are you trying to tell me none of them have ever seen these warnings? With Cameron, he seems to mean well, but I find myself wondering even though he is probably one that has been SERIOUSLY influenced by Hollywood and other big names, if he is sincere, why doesn't he question any of this stuff?

Anyhow as I wrote on this article, the "wonderful plan for your life" stuff is misleading. Thanks for the video. You have made a case there, I never had seen it. Comfort needs to show it to Cameron, who did speak of the PLAN in the article but saying that, why did he go preach with THESE GUYS?

http://apprising.org/2008/07/03/on-ray-comfort-and-word-faith-wolves/

You can't say one thing and then do another. Look I know teachers can make "mistakes", I am sure I have. I even had to disengage myself from a community organization if you see a recent post about "SNARES" but one should be trying their best. I can't go hang out with ecumenicalists, maybe someone could make a mistake and NOT KNOW, but hasn't Comfort been TOLD multiple times? Cameron coming out of the Hollywood matrix, I can give a little more leeway, but Doug Phillips and company? Praising masonic monuments?

continuing...

Bible Believer said...

These were teachers I wanted to be true. I remember even trying tell myself OK they are preaching at TBN, maybe not the best decision but some seemed to have said they did that to get the gospel out there but the more I found out the more the picture worsened.

I watched probably at least a dozen Way of the Master TV shows. I do think the gospel presented while there are some truths presented, it was a bit skewed, they did IMO as REPENT first, instead of BELIEVE first, that is the best way I can explain it. When I was a non-believer why would I repent of anything? I didn't even consider many things sins, and I can understand the desire to seek to convict people, even the best Christian will preach, saying HEY HELL IS REAL AND YOU DON'T WANT TO GO THERE! But something rankled me. Some may say we are being too quibbling here. Maybe so but I think of Cameron and Comfort both hooked in with the teachers they are with, including even involvement with the Duggars who are led by the obviously Jesuit influenced Gothard, and my stomach sinks. Something is not right here.

I agree about the sinner's prayer being valid if it is sincere.

One thing about false teachers, they DO have SOME TRUTHS. [I still agree that the gospel taught is skewed in presentation and the focus on REPENTANCE FIRST] but haven't I warned on this blog about how will use a FEW TRUTHS to introduce endless deceptions? Even I wrote that I repented of my sins in my testimony, but really BELIEF to be LED TO DO SO, had to come first. I BELIEVED FIRST AND FORE MOST. Over the years I've thought about this, there was one time I witnessed to an unbelievers as a new Christian using some vestiges of the Way of the Master method, and everyone was "sorry" for their sins. One even wanting to please me, did a sinner's prayer, but since I had contact with this person, I knew it was not a true conversion. Hey we all have our "failures" but this is where BELIEF has to come first.

Acts 16:31
King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

Bible Believer said...


All those unbelievers can be "sorry" for their sins til the cows come home but until they BELIEVE UNTO the LORD JESUS CHRIST, it means nothing. I know there are subtleties here. Trust me on that one. And I am not trying to be a quibbler, but when I see the association with false teachers, the involvement with Dominionists, and teachers like Gothard, something is VERY WRONG.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QeiclW2lNt0

This video is right about the HUMAN WISDOM AND REASONING.

Hey I made my mistakes as a NEW CHRISTIAN as I explain above. The Holy Spirit is in charge, I know via this blog while I am getting information out there, many times, I write the Holy Spirit has to show people. I know many will come to this blog, and dismiss everything written, and I have no control over that. Why? Because discernment overall is a Holy Spirit driven vehicle. So when they show people on the Way of the Mastering, seeming to be able to "reason" people into Christianity, in real life, it doesn't work that way, and trust me this was an error I made too. I knew belief in my case had to come first, but in fact this is one reason I started to think the WAY OF THE MASTER stuff was misleading. I remember when I was born again, I had to BELIEVE, otherwise it didn't mean anything. Knowing that Jesus is God and REAL--as said in a Catholic catechism--of course another jesus, or that sin is "bad" doesn't cut it. There are endless people in churches now who are at that level and still LOST because they never really believed and trusted in Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior. Do you understand what I mean?

The video is right, about when he tells the girl to STOP SINNING.

Hey they told me that in the RCC, and well....

it meant nothing...no faith, no conviction, no true repentance....

Many things weren't even SINS to me that really were.

No Faith means trying to WORK your way in which is the foundation of false religion.

Anonymous said...

Ray Comfort does teach works for salvation by saying you have to stop sinning, something that nobody is capable of. He is a false teacher that doesn't preach the true Gospel.

Sarah said...

Anonymous, you wrote "Hell bent...
Well if you want to know if I want people the hear the Gospel, then I guess you could say I am bent on keeping people out of hell.

Since I asked a any one of you to present the Gospel, and no one has yet, but you get all upset cuz I asked, to the point of casting more stones ...

I am certain that something is very wrong with this picture.

Casting accusations is not preaching the Gospel." -end quote.

I admire your desire to want to hear the gospel, but the premise of this post is not a gospel presenting post. If you want to hear the gospel there are many many other posts and places to hear it, of course that isn't to say that you cannot hear it here, but it still goes back to the fact that this post isn't about the gospel, it is a post presenting the some objections about Cameron and Comfort.

Furthermore I don't have to go on their websites and hear their videos in order to hear the gospel, I never ever once said on here that they didn't present the gospel.

Whether or not Bible Believer or the other people commenting on here think Cameron and Comfort are false teachers -my next point is not about Cameron and Comfort per-say- doesn't negate the fact that WE ARE to expose false teachers. The Word of God admonishes us to expose false doctrine and not tolerate it.

We are instructed to mark and avoid those teaching error (Romans 16:17-18), we aren’t supposed to keep company with them (I Tim. 6:3-5, 2 Thess. 3:14-15), allow them in our home or greet them (2 John 1:10-11). We are to rebuke them
Titus 1:13 “This testimony is true. Therefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith,”
And if they do not heed correction we are to separate ourselves from them..
Titus 3:10 “A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject”

Not only are we not to tolerate the teaching of these wolves in sheep clothing, but we are to warn the sheep! I am not talking about publicly renouncing everyone who teaches something we do not agree with, but those things pertaining to salvation are not up for debate. We have all heard the story of the boy who cried wolf; labeling everything “damnable heresy” is not what I’m suggesting. However, naming a false teacher or false prophet is godly. It is our responsibility to the sheep when they are teaching “destructive heresy” that is leading people away from the truth of the gospel and therefore away from Jesus and to hell.
Many claim doing so is “persecution.” Heretics are not being persecuted! If they preach another gospel and another Jesus, then they are not brothers and sisters in the Lord, they are not part of the Body of Christ, but apostates! Separating ourselves from them is therefore, not causing division in the Body but is making a distinction between the Bride and the counterfeits, and drawing a line in the sand.

Paul named those in error…
Hymenaeus and Alexander (1 Tim. 1: 18-20)
Hymenaeus and Philetus (2 Tim. 2:15-18)
Demas (2 Tim. 4:10)
Alexander the coppersmith (2 Tim. 4:14-15)
John named Diotrephes (3 John 9)
Jude 1:3-4

So digressing back to your statement on "casting stones" and "not preaching the gospel", one could say that when Paul called out false teachers by name that he wasn't preaching the gospel, was he in error too? No, he was being obedient to the gospel. So again, this post is an EXPOSE, it's not a salvation post. Do I think Cameron and Comfort are false teachers? Ummm, not fully, I don't agree with their calvinist stance and I certainty don't agree with their compromise of being on TBN, but at times they have had good things to say, but I do not follow their ministry nor plan to ever follow their ministry because I do not agree with what I stated, so I plead the 5th there. But putting Cameron and Comfort aside, to say that naming false teacher is "casting stone" is Unbiblical.

Anonymous said...

BB,
You said:
...Anyhow as I wrote on this article, the "wonderful plan for your life" stuff is misleading. Thanks for the video. You have made a case there, I never had seen it. Comfort needs to show it to Cameron, who did speak of the PLAN in the article but saying that, why did he go preach with THESE GUYS?...

Please I am begging you please. Will you please please watch "God's Wonderful Plan" on this site.

http://wayofthemaster.com/videolessons.shtml

Please watch that BB please!

You need to hear what he says first, before we even begin to discuss what others "say" he said. Okay? fair enough?







eric le debonnaire said...

It's maybe rare but i know some who were convicted of being impure sinners , even before knowing what is the Gospel (but Christians were praying for them) ; Anyway it’s only after receiving the Gospel the believers are saved , when the message of the Cross eventually pierces the heart and the veil is removed. Faith comes from hearing the Word of Christ (who He is , what He says ,what He has done ) and then believers are born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which lives and abides for ever (1 Peter 1). Repentance prepares a fertile soil to receive the good seed of the Gospel. Although the Lord uses human vessels , the thirst for a pure heart and the hunger for righteousness and mercy can not be created by human ways, neither a humble heart can be fake before the living God. Blessed are the thirsty and hungry for the Word of God, Word of Truth and Word of His Grace who gives life to the dead. We need to bow down and pray.

Anonymous said...

There you have it! It doesn't look like Cameron has changed his tune... His motives appear to be showing up...

Posted 2 days ago...
(1:28 minutes)
http://youtu.be/KONJaHbbWlY

Anonymous said...

Ray Comfort doesn't teach the way of the true master. Comfort teaches his own way. He adds works to salvation, and that makes Comfort a false teacher with a false gospel.

Rena said...

One thing that does bother me is that this movie is being made in association with Liberty University. Several years ago ( I can find out specifics if anyone wants them) then university President Jerry Farwell took several millions of dollars from Rev Sun Yun Moon as a bailout for his school, that school was "saved" with pagan money. I find that disturbing.

Anonymous said...

Maybe Kirk Cameron will tell everyone he is a Universalist in the movie. He uses Universalist lingo with statements like God will "ultimately restore all things back to Himself.”

That sounds like ultimate reconciliation to me.

Anonymous said...

For me, it is not about man being good. Because man cannot be good on his own (Rom. 3:10-12). Sure, we are made in God's image with a conscience. But because of sin we cannot rely on it to be accurate all of the time (Jer 17:9-10).

Thankfully, God is perfect and He is good (Matt 19:16-17). If God was not good, He would have been done with us a long time ago. But, He loves us. Just like a parent who refuses to give up on a wayward child. Would an evil God go to the cross and suffer for us? Not hardly.

So, a christian can be good in the sense that the holy spirit will help you fight your sin if you let Him. Where as the unsaved do not have that option. But nobody is good in the sense of God's perfection. Thankfully, christians have Jesus to rely on. And Jesus knows us warts and all. Thank God for grace.

Anonymous said...

Let me remind of where this started, I'm addressing the topic of this blog post.
The implication set forth in the post is that Kirk Cameron is preaching a false gospel.
That implication is solidified by Bible Believer who claims in the comments to have watched a lot of Way of the Master stuff and knows they teach a false gospel.
The charge made is:
Kirk Cameron teaches the “PLAN stuff” and that all sin is from God.
I provided links that patently prove those accusations are utterly false. In fact you can listen to any of their past stuff and see this for yourself.

The problem is, folks just stuff their fingers in their ears and scream as loud as they can... NO!!!! Some other guy told me what they teach and so I don't even need to listen to their own words!!!

Well,
You are proven to be false witnesses. Or liars. Instead of repenting; you throw dust in the air, rent your cloths, plug your ears and justify your sin.

You are guilty right here right now and you prove it and you defend your guilt by making believe that others are worse than you. “So and so did/does such and such” so therefore I am far better because I don't do that thing they do... You mock Christ with your false profession (1Jn 1:10), you beat His servants, and you pat yourself and the other mockers on the back in grand approval. You sound exactly like the atheist who rail against them. Just read the comments on the latest video Kirk posted, or even the link BB put in her blog post. (oh yeah... warning: foul language and vile attitudes will be seen in those comments and I don't endorse that there or here)

Your sin isn't just against these guys, your sin is against God Himself.

God hates sin, you are guilty and WILL face His righteous judgment.
You are not exempt.
You should be sorry and stop lying but that won't fix your big problem. It's no different than saying “sorry” for any other vile crimes such as abortion, or manslaughter of a child by driving drunk. For God to forgive such reprehensible sin, is to attribute unjustness to God, or even say God is the author of sin. And you are “above the law”.

But you see, you don't get it. You think if you can find a few more people who are worse than you that will excuses you. “They're worse!” You say. It's the paint for your face to hide what is really underneath. Whitewashing a tomb full of dead mens bones.

God does not forgive your sin (Jer 24:19), He will absolutely by His very Just and Holy nature pay back every sin you ever committed against Him in thought, word, and deed. Everlasting fire... You think NOT ME 'Christian'? See Matt 25:41

Your death won't be the end of the Gospel.
You will never be done with it. You will forever moment by moment curse what you don't have, or be forever moment by moment grateful because you do.

Your sin is not forgiven.
Heading to the electric chair for execution convicted of the sin you commit that is as bad as and worse than murder in God's eyes, a commotion takes place in the hall leading to the chamber, and you are pulled aside. Jesus steps in and takes the hood off of your head, and puts it on His own, showing you the unguarded door to freedom, then sits in your place as the switch is thrown. Zzt ppopp sizzle. Your nose fills with the stench of burning flesh. You either accept His death for you, and walk out free because in the eyes of the law the guilty man died, or you refuse to take off the hood that blinds you and face what you can never endure for all of eternity.

The Cross Jesus died on was far worse than an electric chair, His precious and perfect and innocent blood was shed looking at you. God provided Himself a Lamb the only way for you to be saved, cling to Him! He did this for you with perfect and intense love for you, leave the sin alone that He died for, it's for real been punished by God on Christ, for you. Thank Him now and forever :)!

Anonymous said...

Quote from link in Blog article.

"It’s really a movie about the unstoppable victory of the Gospel through history,"


True in the next paragraph he did say,
"to show that all kinds of tragedies have taken place in the plan of God and He steers that tragedy and uses it to accomplish what He loves and ultimately restore all things back to Himself.”"

But look at the Bible;

Mt 22:44 “‘The Lord said to my Lord, “Sit at my right hand, until I put your enemies under your feet”’?

Mr 12:36 David himself, in the Holy Spirit, declared, “‘The Lord said to my Lord, “Sit at my right hand, until I put your enemies under your feet.”’

Ro 16:20 The God of peace will soon crush Satan under your feet. The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you.

1Co 15:25 For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet.

1Co 15:27 For “God has put all things in subjection under his feet.” But when it says, “all things are put in subjection,” it is plain that he is excepted who put all things in subjection under him.

Heb 2:8 putting everything in subjection under his feet.” Now in putting everything in subjection to him, he left nothing outside his control. At present, we do not yet see everything in subjection to him.

Keep in mind too...

Prov 29:2 When the righteous increase, the people rejoice, but when the wicked rule, the people groan.

Mt 11:19 The Son of Man came eating and drinking, and they say, ‘Look at him! A glutton and a drunkard, a friend of tax collectors and sinners!’ Yet wisdom is justified by her deeds.”

These false accusations need to be repented of.

Bible Believer said...

I watched the show, I know what they teach, I also have done several articles on their associations which if one starts with TBN, are VERY DUBIOUS.

With the movie, I will see it and then post more.

Hey I'm not perfect.

That plan stuff by the way has a lot of subtle aspects to it. I am not sure some people even got what I was talking about, I am seeing the PLAN language all over the place, and happened to notice it here and wanted to post about it as a warning. Could a saved Christian {not talking about these teachers} be led a bit astray by this stuff, SURE. Yes everything works to good for those who love God, etc, etc, but the world is indeed skewing the message to go along with the whole PURPOSE DRIVEN, GOD WILL IMPROVE YOUR LIFE DECEPTIONS.

So you are free to disagree my interpretation of his words.

But how can you ignore

the Dominionsm,

the false patriot-David Barton esque advancement of Americanism [you know the whole city on the hill thing]

The ecumenical associations. The involvement with TBN.

I watched Way of the Master on TBN when I was a new Christian, and even as a babe in Christ asked myself WHAT ARE THOSE GUYS DOING ON THERE?

Even I wrote that I didn't know if in Camerons case if he was deceived or not. He very well could be.

Are you going to tell me those are all false too?

I always find it strange when people elevate mere men and say how dare you question them!

And a few truths tossed in does not mean these guys are true teachers. Even the worse ones, will tell people to be "saved".

I actually have a liking for Kirk Cameron, he seems like a legitmately NICE GUY. I hope one day he is googling away and even find this website, and starts reading about the Dominionists, Vision Forum, and rest, and if he is merely deceived, wakes up and gets away from that mess.

As for the gospel of works, the associations with those who focus on WORKS like Gothard and pals, is a serious problem.

So you are trying to tell me last anon, that anyone who warns against any false teacher, is sinning against God Himself?

Where do you get that?

Bible Believer said...

"all things in subjection" is definitely different from "ultimately restore all things back to Himself". Remember too here, the Dominion where they believe the kingdom is being built here on earth, isn't the word for that RESTORATION THEOLOGY isnt that another word for DOMINION THEOLOGY.

Hey I am not perfect but with these teachers, one better pay attention to the SUBTLE THINGS.

I watched at least 12 shows of Way of the Master, a few more then once.

Something didn't click.

Do I think everyone who tosses in the word REPENT is wrong who is out there witnessing? No, in fact repentance via conviction via the Holy Spirit is a natural outcome of BELIEF.

YOU CANNOT CHANGE YOURSELF

THE HOLY SPIRIT HAS TO CHANGE YOU.

If you are depending on your desire TO BE GOOD, TO STOP SINNING, etc.

YOU will not be saved.

I mean I spent YEARS in the CATHOLIC CHURCH being told STOP SINNING, while I was on the way to hell.

And no this does not condone people living sinful lifestyles, but I hope what I am saying here is understood.

But what is that long list of 10 commandments supposed to do for the lost?

I heard that LIST in the Catholic church--well a slightly altered one.

See where I am going with that.

Sarah said...

Was curious of what you all think of this article: http://expreacherman.com/2013/07/28/lordship-salvation-icon-kirk-cameron-promotes-calvins-geneva-bible-and-teams-up-with-liberty-university/

Anonymous said...

Both Cameron and Comfort add works to salvation by backdooring the works. Thus both of them are false teachers with false gospels that lead to hell.

Bible Believer said...

I agree Comfort and Cameron add works. Isn't that the basic legalist problem with many of their jesuit influenced associates like Gothard?

Bible Believer said...

Sarah they make some good points but I would say be careful of the easy believism crowd from that other side too. That crowd downplays the warnings in the bible, about examining yourself if you are in the faith, 2 Cor 3:15

http://galatiansfour.blogspot.com/2010/07/grahams-easy-believism-millions-of.html

Sarah said...

Bible Believer, I dont follow this blog, I have read some articles here and there but I dont subscribe to it. I dont think they believe in easy believeism, since they have spoken out against it themselves. And spoken out against Billy Graham, Paul Washer etc.

Anonymous said...

I love the expreacherman site!

Rena said...

@anonymous -July 30, 2013 at 9:16 AM

What bravery! You authoritatively reproach each and everyone of us, for just about everything under the sun as far as I can tell. All the while, you are guilty of the very things that you accuse others of, being judgmental, self-righteous, presumptuous, false accusations etc....all the while hiding behind an unknown name. If you are going to "rail on some one" in the name of God at least be bold enough to show yourself!

NICK JR said...

This was an insightful video it revealed a lot of secrets I didn't even know I do not do yoga but someone I'm really close to does so I will send this video to her so that she will be inspired to stop and pass the message on to others