Saturday, June 23, 2012

Stay At Home Daughter Says SUBMIT TO YOUR DAD!

This is scary stuff. By the way, I have seen dozens of blogs like this, I decided to coment on this one.

"5 Reasons To Submit To Your Dad"

Here are some back ground articles on the SAHD daughter movement.

"More Disturbing Things about the Duggars" [Scroll down to the part about Daddy's Girls"]

"Two Sides of the Same Evil Coin: Radical Feminism Vs. The Patriarchy Movement"

The patriarchy movement is teaching that young ADULT women must stay under their father's authority until they marry. This means if they never marry, and are 40 years old and living at home, their father remains their "authority". Imagine being 35 years old and never married and having to ask your father permission to go to the store. That is that world. Like Radical Islam, a woman is mandated to always be under male authority, whether, it be a husband, or father.

Anyhow I saw this blog the other day...this lady who appears to be somewhere in her early 20s tells us to SUBMIT TO YOUR DAD. She states:

 "As a single adult woman I have made the choice to be a stay-at-home daughter. I live with my family and flowing out of that I have chosen to submit to my parents; and more specifically my father’s authority. I have chosen to do this until the day I am given in marriage to my future husband, when I will willingly begin to submit to him."

I wrote on this blog before, it's like they want women to stay perpetual children. By the way this goes hand in hand with the Dominionism and one can see even in the SAHD writings, the odd use of terms like "vision", and phrases like  "dominion of their spheres of influence in the home". Odd, how such a supposedly so traditional movement lays the new religious lingo on thick!

I hate to say it but if you never have the ability to live as an independent adult, how do you later take care of children and a husband? What if your husband dies? I find this movement extraordinarily foolish and based in false history even thinking of the practical matters of life. Women in the old days went to the market to sell eggs. She had to take care of the livestock and the farm when Pa was away from home for months on a railroad track construction job or looking for work. I also ask, what if one's father dies? Those who hit their middle aged years, know the numbers of those who have lost their fathers, outnumbers those who still have them. What kind of man would even want to marry a woman who essentially never grew up?

I often wonder about how much of this extreme stuff on the sociological front is a pendulum swing due to the bad economy and the breakdown of community. I hate to say it but every little home as a FORTRESS against the world, ISN'T GOING TO WORK. Is that what has become of American culture? Leave me out of it.

How many ultra securely employed Dominionist religious young men who will pass Daddy's screenings are there? At least they should be honest, and do what other cultures have done and make the switch to "arranged" marriages where parents arrange marriages between those of the same culture and/or religion. No I do not condone that, but think this one out, they are not allowed to date, they have no social means to meet this young man, they do not have sing-a-longs like the Amish, so as they see more and more young women home for life, this whole SAHD Quiverful culture will be forced into change. Look at the Duggar daughters, while I believe in chasity and waiting for marriage as the Bible tells us, they are akin to women living in convent. One commenter at this article--posted above, commented on the transition to early Greco-Roman culture aspects of life, I found that interesting. Women in Greco-Roman culture, were not allowed to have any part to play in the public sphere, they definitely were under full male control. Isn't Dominionism and this stuff, about returning to paterfamilias? 

I see how she speaks of the world being "dangerous" and of "creepy men".  The Duggar daughters all seemed afraid when a friendly stranger at the Dead Sea came over to say hello and had Jim Bob chase him away. What if that could have been a future husband? Dare I say that this bloggers attitude towards men is not a very positive one? That she has been taught to only fear? Young women should be raised to discern and be strong in themselves, where she would not need her father to know if she was being deceived by a false man with ill intentions.

I and my friends have spoken of how our more liberally feminist inclined families threw us out into the world to "sink or swim". Mine was Catholic but definitely held to all the new feminist lines. With the destruction of community, lives spent moving all over the place--in my case I was instructed to put the "career" first and told to move a thousand miles even if that is what it took, and moved to a enourmous metro city alone at one point to stay employed as young 20 something. I knew some of us thought something was very wrong with that side of things too. Friends have told me, they wish for lives of 50 years ago rather then what happened in our lifetimes. Today I know that many priorities are off. People should put family and community higher, with God of course first. But this as the answer? That is insanity. This is American Taliban stuff.

She speaks of having "financial responsiblity" taken off of her as well. That is scary too. Again parents die. What will she do on her own in the world? I think it is beyond irresponsible how these parents leave these "adult" children with no workable skills. I do believe women should stay at home with children, if at all possible, though I know more and more in this economy it is not possible. Men lose jobs. Men get sick, whether it is a temporary illness or a long term illness or injury.

When she mentions "Pressure", that is called being a grown up and being held responsible for your own decisions. Yes we all will make mistakes. Here too, I wonder if some girls seeing the changes in this world are wanting to stay home. One can understand the fear and trepidation considering this world, but this is no answer. These movements are not coming out of a vaccum.

The focus is entirely on her father, this is not healthy whatsoever.

Being a stay-at-home daughter helps me have a good, close relationship with my entire family, including my father. Living in the same home as my father allows me to regularly see and learn what things are important to him. I would have missed out on so many opportunities to get to know my father if I did not choose to live under his loving authority!

What about the things that important to her? Part of growing up is having your own values and developing one's own relationship with God. She seems far more invested in SUBMITTING to her father and getting to know him, then she does to obeying God and having a relationship with God. Why is her father the ultimate center of the household?

Sadly she is stuck in error, God does not except this. Just so people know, I have personally known at least three families raising daughters this way. Some got sucked in via the homeschool movement, all support Dominionism, and are part of the church system. Some may see this movement as extreme fringe, but I think the numbers are actually growing higher out there. I am seeing even past church families I used to know starting to adopt things like this which troubles me. I find myself thinking a lot about why such things are being promoted. Remember "biblical femininity" which she brings up in the video is being advanced even through many "mainstream" Dominionist groups.

I did leave a comment to her blog first, sending her links to my earlier articles. She did not post it and I did not hear back. I hope she and others like her in the SAHD movement can come out of the legalism and realize these things they are being told to adhere to are NOT biblical.

Phl 4:3         And I intreat thee also, true yokefellow, help those women which laboured with me in the gospel, with Clement also, and [with] other my fellowlabourers, whose names [are] in the book of life.


Douglas A. Willinger said...

This post makes me think of the story within my recent post 'Jane 1971' about my lost 1st love's dad that August.

Anonymous said...

I followed your link to Christianity Today blog, the article make some good points, however as I surfed through the blog, I found it to be just as troublesome as the
Stay at Home Daughters Movement.

One blog was on the positive side of the book Fifty Shades of Grey...positive side...really?

I am somewhat disappointed that you used Christianity Today and that link to that Blog, in the end it was detrimental to your supporting evidence because there is not much Truth in that website.

Just my thoughts please, I do enjoy your blog it was that other blog that upset me I guess.


Anonymous said...

What is the purpose of this philosophy?

The Bible says that Christians need to be mature in the faith, shrewd, innocent, wise, productive and holy. These character traits do not develop in a cloistered vacuum. A person’s mettle and character are built by experiencing the challenges that normally occur in a lost culture and also, frankly, in the church. This process requires deliberate effort and patience on the part of believing parents.

The SAHD philosophy allows the father to be a dictator, and at the same time allows him to abdicate his responsibility to counsel and guide his girls. It denies daughters the right to develop skills, intellect, knowledge and achievements. It trains them to be fearful and dependent rather than courageous and resourceful.

The Bible is full of examples of godly women who were active and productive out in the world, and yet did not disobey God’s commandments (usurping authority in the home or church etc.). Jesus Christ our Lord had a number of devout followers who were women, and they did not stay at home all the time!

Luke 23:55-24:10
23:55 And the women also, which came with him from Galilee, followed after, and beheld the sepulchre, and how his body was laid……………24:10 It was Mary Magdalene and Joanna, and Mary the mother of James, and other women that were with them, which told these things unto the apostles.

Aka Alert

Bible Believer said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Bible Believer said...

I was going to write that I posted the Christianity Today link with misgivings. So yes I understand, where you are coming from. Not my first link of choice, but then on the "conservative" websites, outside anti-fundamentalist Christian websites or secular websites, there is very little discussion of the SAHD issue. I should have added a caveat on that one.

Bible Believer said...

Thanks for your post Doug.

That had to be hard to go through.

Reminds me of a very old memory of mine.

Two homeschooled girls who lived 5 houses down from me. They were never allowed to play with any other kids in the neighborhood. Their Dad kept them as prisoners basically in the house. I was too young to understand all these groups back then, but still think about those girls, watching the rest of us neighborhood kids play from THEIR WINDOWS.

Anonymous said...

I enjoy Douglas Willinger's work on exposing the horrors of the Vatican. Good to see him.

Bible Believer said...

I have read some interesting things over there too..

Bible Believer said...

To above Anon, I agree

Christians are supposed to be mature in the faith and have those other qualities, so how does some girl who is basically locked in the house supposed to develop even in the face of standing against evil in this world? Some young woman who has never met a challenge is really unready for anything. I actually think this is an ultimate betrayal by any parent to leave a child so woefully unprepared for the world. By the way, with the few SAHD's I haven known some are very sweet, but one sees them as being a far younger age. I am not talking about chastity here which is good for all young women who are not married to have but a basic immaturity where a 21 year old old talks and acts like a 13 year old and has not developed the natural separtion as being an individual adult from her parents. In other words, they have not grown up.

You are right this is about fathers that want to be dictators who let go of the responsibility to guide and counsel a girl to grow into a mature woman. I hate to say it but young women being left without skills, intellect or knowledge, in this world is going to make this world far more of a dangerous place. This to be honest is one of the things that most bothers me about the Duggars and I talk about this quite a bit, how they essentially live like women in a cloistered convent this time serving as servants to their parents and replacement parents for their brothers and sisters except in this case with no freedom of choice or self direction.

I agree about the active, productive and godly women out in the world.

All I have to do is compare what radical Islam says should be the role for women and daughters and this SAHD stuff is no different. At least in the radical Islam girl's case, her parents will make arrangements for her to marry, the SAHD daughter is stuck in the house for some Prince Charming that probably will never materialize after a lifetime of being told to avoid boys like the plague and that all their endeavors are for "Daddy's betterment and will".

FLSD is no different from this stuff either.

Thank you AKA ALERT

Anonymous said...

Thanks Bible Believer for your reply.

Interesting that even as a seasoned Christian a website like Christianity Today could get to me.

I am glad to know you were not endorsing that blog, which of course is never all bad, just bad enough.

I guess it is time to get my "Big Boy Pants" on and deal with it. I bet the SAHD crowd would not like that expression. :-)

In all seriousness, I do recognize how sad this is for women, God calls all of us to grow in Him. If all women stay at home under their fathers authority until marriage it removes a lot of laborers from the field.

That is where my joy has been in life, serving God, witnessing to the world of His immeasurable Grace, not washing pots and pans.


Bible Believer said...

Hey L. I understand

I know I am getting limited even in resources I could post without a caveat, there are so many compromised areas, I just follow that no 100% endorsements rule. I think the having women submit to fathers stuff is insane, even if you bring non-Christian fathers, abusive fathers, etc, into the picture. This idea that everyone's father will be a born again Christian is absurd as well. Even ones who say they are very well could NOT be, false conversions etc.

I wonder if Daddy over on that blog supervises the comments. It seems these types never hear or read other viewpoints. I think the whole thing is rather frightening and creepy too. You are right it would take laborers out of the field. I never was one for housework either though because I am married have to do some, LOL.

This also reminds me of Mormonism where the man of the household is considered "the priest" of every person in that specific household.

Barksplinter said...

If you are not going to post my post then please don't rebut me.
This sort of censoring of opposing views wreaks of the CC Moses Berg Model.
Chuck Smith, Raul Reis, Bob Grenier, and Bob Coy would be proud.
For a moment there I thought I heard John Higgins whispering in the background. LOL!!!

It is your blog and therefore YOUR right to edit as you see fit, but you have certainly lost a lot of credibility with me and a few others I have mentioned this to.
Gored your ox did I?

Well.... I still like your blog and will be dropping by to see what you got... but in the future I will take your articles with a bit more than a couple of grains of salt.

God Bless.

Bible Believer said...

Some comments get tossed into spam.

I post opposing views here all the time. Do screen out those playing games, etc.

Your comment on the other article was posted.

Tamara said...

Good quotes from Pastor Andrew Sandlin's essay regarding the dangers of The Hegemonic Patriarchy:

"The authority that some patriarchalists arrogate to themselves truly borders on tyranny. One has written that a father who sends his daughter off to college is guilty of irresponsibility. Apparently, all daughters must maintain residence in their father’s household to be deemed “under authority.” Not a shred of Biblical evidence supports this theory and, in fact, at times the father may be guilty of irresponsibility if he does not dispatch an intellectually gifted daughter to college. (The idea that children should ordinarily stay home and take Internet college courses is fraught with peril. We will never train culture-reclaiming physicians, nuclear physicists, and engineers by such apron-centered, kitchen-table tutelage.)"

Anonymous said...

women should stay home-they have no business b eing in the work force-my mother was a women's libber and believed the devil's lies-she should have stayed home to raise me when I needed her-instead she chose a "career" and neglected me leaving me to raise myself-I never will forgive her-either choose a career OR a family-not both..women who go against what the scripture teaches are just plain stupid and will regret it and their children will hate them like I do my mom

Bible Believer said...

I am sorry you were neglected. I am sorry you hate your mother. If she is wicked, one may even have to depart from a wicked mother directed by God, but do not let the anger lead you to sin or hate. I believe life was far better when women did not have to work jobs but could take care of families. Even childless women could take care of a husband or household or if single be an auntie and an integral part of the family. Historically many poor women had to work, so I do not judge them, but the ideal is for men to be the providers of a family. However the Duggars teach a false patriarchialism that is about legalism. People today are trying to operate in a system that works against them. I do not blame a woman for working if it means she has to stay off the streets. Some women may have talents and skills they are led to share with the world too. Many men now will not let their wives be housewives and the new world order planned things in the way that one income does not decently support a family anymore. Feminism hurt me as a young woman like you were hurt as a young men, since I was thrown into the streets even when sick to sink or swim just because of being old. I was not led to marriage or a family but to a career. Well for my generation, the careers don't offer any empowerment but often low pay and lay-offs, they don't care for you like having a husband or a caring family. I was able to marry but I still remember this. I was a latch-key kid too, starting at age 9. So I am not thrilled about how life is run now with everyone slaves to the corporations or McJobs. The Duggars are still in a cult though and Jim Bob still wants way too much control over his grown daughters and even it seems his son-in laws.

Bible Believer said...

My father was an atheist [pretending to be Catholic for sake of my mother] If I followed the Duggar daughter's code, I'd be stuck in some convent. My father told me to join the convent even after I had left the Catholic church. Submitting to one's earthly biological or adoptive human father as an adult is not taught in the bible.