Sunday, April 22, 2012

For Christians Without Churches: Two Videos

There are many who have left churches. I know I have been dealing with the years of being outside the fellowship of a church, and have shared on this blog, why I am not in a church, and the false teachings that have kept me and others out. Many who write me at this blog have had to make that same decision. Please watch these videos especially if you are a Christian outside the church system like myself, they were of help and comfort to me.

I agree with this man about learning about the Bible on your own. The Holy Spirit is to be our teacher. I read the Bible myself, and ask God all the time to teach me. He is right that the pastors are not teaching "scriptural doctrine"and that they are not teaching the Word of God from the Bible. Like him, I found instances where pastors would teach something and it would not match the Bible. In the false churches here in my present community that happened constantly. The churches here are mostly either liturgical ones or modern evangelical ones in full apostasy.

I believe fellowship is important, for me not having that kind of community in day to day life IS not easy. It is not easy for any Christian who has had to make that choice. I still have open communication with some of my old church members, my old fundamentalist church was devastated via economic factors, and underwent changes with a new pastor. My old church members know I am not in a church, one old church member told me she would pray for me and I talked to her recently about what I had faced. Most have understood why I am outside the churches.

The Church is a hospital for sinners. He is right about that but we want a hospital who passes out life giving "medicine". He has a point about those who have a judgmental attitude. I try to meet people where they are at and question myself even doing this blog, knowing while I have found these things out I should never use it to lord it over anyone. I am just here to share what I have learned.

He is right that a lot of people have gotten away from God because of the situation in the churches. God does want us to draw close to Him. One's relationship with God should come first. In fact many things happening in the churches pushes people away from Him. With God, I had no choice but to obey when God told me, "Get out of here!"

Here is Part 2

I am glad he tells people that it is OK to be outside of a church. He is right about there being many of us who have had to leave the churches. While I know I struggle with my own loneliness related to this issue, I know from even letters sent to this blog and elsewhere, people like us are out there. I have met the "you have to go to church" contingent, but then I have said, to such people, "the body of Christ exists outside of brick and mortar buildings". For me, too the church is the collected body of those in Christ. It is the ekklesia. He is right about those who are out of churches who would prefer a local body of a believers but must make that hard decision.

Being outside of a church does not make you less of a Christian, he is accurate in warning about that. I would hope people would rethink this matter too. Here too, I agree with him, I am not perfect either, so understand where he is coming from. One of the most important things is drawing close to God. He is right, it is hard without a church family. I had a loved church family for years, even being taken away from them was a grief filled enterprise. I have contact with my old church family via the Internet, but I know they also served a purpose in preparing me especially as a new Christian. He is right about it being a bit harder without the support of others in a physical community but that is where God's help comes in.

I know if I found a preacher who teaches the word of God correctly [these are growing very rare] and I could find another church family, I would be open to it. I have the fellowship via the Internet as well. Many here who respond to this blog who I write with, have been a source of great support as well. The advice to stay in the Word of the God and fellowship as you are able, is great advice.

Rom 12:5 So we, [being] many, are one body in Christ, and every one members one of another.


Bible Believer said...

To the person who wrote me this [Ruth? Emily?] [I edited out more complaining about Scott Johsnon, start your own blog if you do not feel this one is up to snuff. I have said I do not 100% endorse any websites at all anymore, and I disagree with him on the Nephilim. His website does have a lot of information same as someone visiting others. I do not know why you keep writing me complaining about this person, I asked you to show me EXACT statements and the rest long ago and you never bothered, so I do not want to hear it anymore. I am not a blind follower of man, so using a link on my blog to attack me is silly.

"Hebrews 10:25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching. what you propose is not biblical you suggest we forsake the great commission and cease from exhorting one another... you post the most insane people on the web and suggest we waddle in their self indulgent, never fasted, messed up theology .."

Where did I say we cease from exhorting each other? The man in the video didn't say that either, did you even watch them? Where did I say forsake the Great Commission either as well?

With the false churches if you are the person, I think you are, I know you have stayed defending a church system, that has been exposed multiple times on this blog, and even with such information, have chosen to ignore it's implications and God's commandments regarding daughters of and the harlot itself.

Anonymous said...

I liked what you have said to clarify that if one is able to connect with a local fellowship of believers where a pastor is rightly dividing the Word and can be trusted to discern, then go for it.

But many are disenfranchised and are located where there is no choice. Each one has to seek the Lord as to the "solution" to this and how to find fellowship. It can be in a small group or online.

But one must be cautious about some "home churches" that are even more deceptive than what one came out of. The early church set the example of a model and it should be closely held to as much as possible.

Also, one must be be cautious about Bible teachers online - they must be able to stand up to scrutiny of the Word and sound doctrine.

There are trustworthy gifted Bible teachers who provide valuable help to exposit the Word, but most of them have completed their course and are home with the Lord. One should stay away from any preachers who are on TV or are living in this day of apostasy. One can't be lackadaisical about it. It requires study and research and seriously seeking the Lord.

And one must be on guard against snares no matter where one is. If a pastor is unaccountable, that is a green light to leave. If they listen and heed and act, that is different - they have a humble heart, no arrogance.

These aren't ordinary times even though error and false teaching have been with us since the Garden.. But the deception has become more devious and discernment has become unpopular.

Thanks again for explaining your situation as there must be many who can identify. God did raise up pastors/teachers for our edification, but there are many blind shepherds and hirelings and the apostasy is in full bloom. We can't be caught up in following men, but trust them only by the standard of God's Word.

coz said...

Haven't watched the videos yet cos of bandwidth limitations, but I think that we are in the 'trust no-one but God' 'ravening wolves' phase (ie the fox is guarding the hen house) stage and to trust in ministers and pastors and other churchgoers obviously can open one up to deception.

Since we're judged alone it's also up to the individual to form their own understanding of what the bible is saying.

I only attended church in childhood for a few years, did a bit of 'church shopping' when I became one at about age 40, but it all seems about the money to me. Not being a huge 'people person' I'm ok with it, more socially inclined people probably find it difficult.

It's also a territorial war, what I've seen is that the enemy infiltrates and takes control of churches and dogma, not just to spread apostasy but also to seize the financial assets as well. I think the mammon worshippers value those things, so let them have it. There's a difference between a churchian and a christian.

Anonymous said...

Thank you for sharing
I really like

Bible Believer said...

To this poster I wanted to respond, I am just including parts of her messages...

"The Church System I am defending is: ALL OF THEM literally all of them... be they whores or the mother of whores, they belong to Jesus, and He will dispatch them as He will..."

Why on earth would someone see the apostate church system as "belonging" to Jesus? That is total nonsense, if anything the deceivers and rest all work for the devil.
"Where on this planet is a good church? where??? even the scattered church is full of sinners who sin, who can be called worthy??"

The Bible warns about the great falling away, if one believes the Bible, they understand that THIS IS HAPPENING NOW.

" Jesus can ... that's who ! and He does it to His people while they are in bad churches too~!!"

If I remember correctly, I said there WERE SAVED PEOPLE even in bad churches.

Why else does God refer to MY PEOPLE when He is telling them to get out of there?

Rev 18:4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.

"He still saves them~!! Halleluiah~!!! He can save ANYONE ANYWHERE in ANY APOSTATE CHURCH ... and do it while they are still in it, did He intend us to run away from them like fearful idiots?"

In her response here where she writes, Did he intend us to run away from them like fearful idiots"


See above.

"NO we were to stay with them"


"and CONTEND for the TRUTH for real"

How do you do that within an apostate system? The false preachers have been trained to get rid of dissenters. Wake up!

For me this summed up, the deception you are within.

Bible Believer said...

Anon, if someone can find a local fellowship of believers, yes go for it. I have prayed for the same, and searched. I do know there are other Christians in my position.

Here where I am at there is no choice, I actually have been kind of surprised but that is how it is getting out there. As more of the fundamentalist and other independents fall to Dominionism and other infiltrations, the choice is getting even far less.

Thanks for warning about home churches, the Emergents actually have FOCUSED INTENTLY on those forming their own EMERGENT focused home churches. In fact many of the search websites for home churches [yes I've seen them all] have many Emergent churches, then too one has to watch out for false Hebrew Roots, cults and SDA stuff, when out there in the home church world. I believe there are good ones out there, but one has just as careful in that world just as with online teachers.

I agree about the pastors who have a humble heart. There is a big difference between someone you may have a minor disagreement with and can discuss things wtih and one of the false ones who lords it on from on high that you cannot question.

Bible Believer said...

Sorry you couldnt see the videos, maybe if you can get to the library you can watch them there. I agree about us being in the trust no one but God phase of things. I refuse 100% endorsement of any website for a reason. There is too much funny business going on out there in this world. Yes to trust in men today definitely will bring trouble and many of the deceivers are very crafty, they KNOW the Bible, they have very high IQs, they are excellent authors and speakers. But unless one is listening to God first and knowing the Holy Spirit is your true teacher, the set up for deception is immense, and goes so deep now, even finding out to what level via this blog, has been astounding.
You are right a lot of the church game is the money game. Making merchandise of people, and that is what they do.

With the territorial stuff, if one even examines the history of apostasy one can trace their encroachment. I even have a book written by Ralph Winter that talks about the WORLD CHURCH MOVEMENT back in the 1980s. They actually were quite open with their future "battle maneuveurs" and they are today by the way if you know where to look.

Like that term churchian....vs. Christian.

Bible Believer said...

above is in response to coz....

Christian Cerna said...

I understand why many feel discouraged with the state of modern American churches. I know I feel that way often. Especially with the rise in mega-churches. It seems that more and more Christians are seeking these larger Churches, not because they really think they are better churches, but because they no longer want to commit to any church. But they also don't want to stop attending a church, because their conscious would bother them, or because when people ask what they did this weekend, they can sound like a good christian and say they went to church. We are living in an age of 'Church Shoppers'. These are people that jump from church to church, looking for something new, always finding imperfections in people, and looking for what the church has to offer them, instead of what they can offer the church. This is very dangerous for the church, because a healthy church requires that people commit to a congregation, and spend years there, so that they can get to know one another, and grow together, and be accountable to one another.

Nealreal said...

I watched both your videos and I feel you Bible Believer. I left the IC (institutional church) 4 years ago and just recently been led to start a fellowship were we just get out the bible and study it for ourselves with the help the holy Spirit. I believe this is how it was in the Acts church and how will be for the called out remnant of God. I just wanted to let you know there is a tool out there that connects people who left the IC with others. God bless.

Bible Believer said...

I'll check your website out. I want to tell my readers to be careful. I hope you are a sincere person and that is a REAL website. I think something like that could be useful as long as you keep the information VERY PRIVATE, so it can'tbe used against Christians. I used to search for a housechurch using websites online, but it was a fruitless endeavor, at least acouple seemed owned by the "Emergents". Well I will check it out, thanks.