Saturday, January 7, 2012

"Roger Oakland, an Enigma Revealed in These Last Days"

As I wrote on this blog article, this is not the endorsement of the blog shown but for the information presented.

"Roger Oakland, an Enigma Revealed in These Last Days"

Sad to say he probably is not the only one out there warning about Emergents, and the rest while working with those involved with Rome. I found the information about the Knights of Malta founding the CFR very interesting, well it makes sense.

I'll be frank there are so many things leading back to Rome, it isn't funny. I have even been pondering the Quiverful/Patriarchy-Schaeffer connections, I researched today, and their very ecumenical standings and where everything is leading. "A Great Conspiracy" is a phrase that doesn't even give all this delusion justice.

The blog author is correct that Roger Oakland gives out advice that if heeded calls Roger Oakland on the carpet for keeping religious company with Chuck Missler.

One chart on his website I found very interesting.

To get to the original I went [click on the link on his page, provided UNDER the chart and checked out things for myself. I circled names I found of interest.


Well I guess that makes sense consider Missler's connections to Chuck Smith. Brian Hughes also has been shown on the SwanSat rosters as well on some of these blogs.

But Pat Matrisciana being on the list is of interest as well: Council for National Policy, etc. Well read my post here:  "Caryl Matrisciana, Wide is The Gate and The Council For National Policy"

Steel on Steel too? The people from Idaho who warn about "conspiracy" theories?
I have some Steel on Steel DVDs a friend sent me but only listened to very few.

Dr. Walter Martin, he had to be made a member after death? Why? He is the guy who refused to include the Catholic church, in his book "Kingdom of The Cults".

Joseph Farah too? My, this spiderweb has been thrown pretty far all over the place. Well I figured out World Net Daily long ago, was doing the drumbeats for Dominionism and false evangelical political agendas long ago. Wonder if they have up any articles telling us to go to war with Iran this week? I should check. Joseph Farah I talked about in this blog article from long ago called Joseph Farah and Hebrew Roots.  By the way I was a new Christian reading World Net Daily for a time thinking it was a "good website". Sigh.

Wasn't Ergun Caner, the man who had some controversy about his past story? Memories are faulty but they even investigated him.

Alan Keyes, that is strange too, but he is all over the right wing in different capacities beyond trying to become a candidate for president.


news4themasses said...

Many of those on the Board of Regents to Koinonia House are also on the COMPASS speakers list. Chuck Missler has a lot of money invested in these speakers. The "first" prophesy conference I ever went to had: Chuck Missler, David Hocking, Roger Oakland, and I believe Jacob Prasch. It was at a Lutheran Church ironically. I heard about it through a friend while we attended a CC. The group boasted that holding the Conference at the Lutheran Church was a great victory, because they would be hearing "Discernment" however, later I found out much of that Lutheran Church protested and didn't even attend the Conference. It was in essence a means to funnel CC'ers into the Lutheran Church. Now, knowing what I know it all appears "Inter-denominational" if you ask me. A great "Victory" to some and a great tragedy to others. It makes total sense though now for me, as I look at all these Speakers, and notice that they are speaking all over the place, from Baptist Churches to other denominational venues it's clear that the move is to "catch" everyone "up" in deception contrary to their message of "Discernment." Many of the "News" agencies used by "Christian Camp" are contrived and long time brethren (ie CNP/Family/Jesuits etc.) Maybe I should just post all the stuff I've found out in the past 6 months and let the people decide for themselves.

Anonymous said...

There never seems to be an end to all of this. It would be much easier to be able to come up with a list of those who are NOT connected and are beholden to NO ONE except the Lord Jesus Christ. Afraid that list would be very short and would probably be made up of people who would not be a household word in evangelical circles.

BTW Alan Keyes is a devout Roman Catholic. I was quite surprised to see Charles Ryrie listed - why would he see the need to get into bed with Missler?

Many of the truth-loving saints are getting extremely weary. Those of us who are trying in our own little way to warn are being told that people are tired of hearing of these things. The big names are so entrenched through their programs, their books, conferences and their network of scratching each other's back that they have pretty much won over the average Christian who just wants to hear positive things. And those who are posing as discerners play the game but all the while they are playing footsie under the table with their cohorts and laughing all the way to the bank. Sickening!!!

Somehow we who are painfully aware must find a way to press on and cling to the Rock and know that He will sustain us through this tsunami of apostasy.

It isn't easy and most of us feel abandoned and alone, rejected and without fellowship except for those we find online who understand. And the latest can of worms, revealing Roger Oakland's hypocrisy are so very painful. You could say we are in mourning, grieving while the rest of the Christian world is oblivious. But our God knows and we have to lean on Him HARD and keep our eyes on Him.

news4themasses said...

Regarding my last comment, I did some recon and Jacob Prasch was not at that Conference. It was held at Community Church of Joy in Glendale AZ, September 2006. Speakers were: Roger Oakland, Chuck Missler, David Hocking and Bill Koenig. It was broadcast or recorded via Godly Conferences, John Higgins' website, however there is no trace of it online. Ironic. Only advertisement I could find was this obscure site:

and this one:

Bible Believer said...

I guess it's better to just trust those who are not known names and even there be careful. Yes you are right Alan Keyes is a Catholic isn't he? I don't know anything about Ryrie. Yeah I am weary too. The big names are entrenched. It's a religious world I want nothing to do with.

I am grieving over this stuff too, its hard. Thanks news4themasses for sharing your experience at that conference as well.

Bible Believer said...

News4masses, I hope you can post more of what you learned. I know posting some of this stuff can be difficult. This blog article was based on someone else's research linking to their blog for the information, but finding some of this stuff out can be difficult. I can see they are inter-mingling the churches too. [inter-denominational] via all the parachurch ministries and more, those outside organizations are having many different types of churches involved in the World Christian Movement. That may be a better way to explain what exactly the WORLD CHRISTIAN MOVEMENT means and is about [all that interdenominationalism]

yes we have to LEAN on God now.

Anonymous said...

There are actually 5 Calvary Chapel pastors on that roster.

Necromancy and "The Shack" promoter, Steve Berger, is a Calvary Chapel pastor too.

Grace Chapel is a Calvary Chapel.

However, Ron Matsen, Roger Oakland's Chairman of the Board and a Director for the necromancy promoter, Chuck Missler, just officially left his Calvary Chapel position in England on 12/31/2011.

Anonymous said...

Avi Lipkin isn't even a believer.

Every person that rejects Jesus as the Messiah is an antichrist according to 1 John 2:22 -

"Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son."

Nick V. said...

To the author of this galatiansfour blog: Before you propagate this slanderous article any further you should contact Roger directly and get his side of the story and his involvement.

The blog entry you re-posted was originally written by a disgruntled blog author who presented Roger with the information regarding Missler and wanted Roger to immediately publish it on the UTT website. (If you aren't aware Roger has been extremely busy with speaking engagements and helping widows and orphans in Africa. This is not an excuse but rather real life commitments) According to Rodger, he told the blog author to call Missler himself and to publish it on his own blog. The blog author then became upset with Roger's response and used the information he found on Missler to slanderously attack Roger by falsely incorporating Roger as part of a Missler/CNP/Roman Catholic alliance.

I like your blog even though I don't always agree with all of your opinions and research. But now in this post you are regurgitating slanderous dis-information to all your blog followers and damaging Rogers reputation.

Roger is not a Board of Regent of the Koinonia Institute. But Roger did receive an honorary Gold Medallion from Missler. (Which Roger had NO knowledge of prior to the suprise presentation) According to my conversation with Roger, Roger barely knew Missler personally but did receive a phone call from Missler after Roger became dis-associated with Calvary Chapel Costa Mesa. Prior to Rogers departure from CCCM, CCCM had given Missler the boot. During the phone call Missler ended up inviting Roger to use his film production facilities for free so Roger could finish a video he had been working on. While Roger was in Idaho producing his video, out of the blue, Missler surprisingly presented Roger with an honorary Gold Medal. Roger didn't think much of it but just graciously accepted it.

My 2 cents... Missler is a VERY smart guy, has a government background and has been trained at a very high level. Unfortunately the information regarding Missler appears to be true regarding his CNP connects, the facts are obvious. This is sad because I like Missler (I think he is sincere but at the same time somewhere he has been deceived).

Anyways, the following is something to think about... If you were in some operation and your assignment (knowingly or un-knowingly) was to support and enable infiltrators, wouldn't you want also to cover the infiltrators with some credible people so it would be harder for people to recognize the infiltrators? What better cover is there than by giving an honorary award to a credible person like Roger Oakland (and maybe other recipients) who like Roger has a solid record of contending for the faith, exposing the works of darkness, and preaching the gospel for roughly 30 years... don't you think it will add some credibility to your institution and the "other guys" you are publicly promoting and secretly enabling??? (even if you are aware of it or deceived)

See, these guys are smart. They need and use guys like Roger to blend in their infiltrators on "assignment", they give away honorary awards to the good guys so the sheep can't figure out the bad guys. You might see it and some others might see it, but the majority of the sheep don't even see it coming, they just go along with the rest of the flock!

I strongly encourage you to consider everything and don't be so quick to judgement. I hope you take down what you wrote and do what is right between you and Roger and your blog readers.

Bible Believer said...

So Avi Lipkin isn't a believer? Hmm seems he is Jewish, I looked at website and did not see anything about being a Christian or converted to Jesus Christ on there. If we are wrong, someone correct us.

He seems to warn about Islam a lot, and there are dangers in Islam and I have warned about it as a false religion even on this blog, but remember what I wrote about Christian Zionism how the controllers of this world are using both sides against the middle? The Pope playing Talmudic Judaism and Islam like a fiddle?

It seems odd to me that you would invite someone to your church to lecture on these things, who isn't a born again believer [well as far as I know] and the state of the world. If they are not a Christian then they do not have the Holy Spirit to give others truth.

Talmudic Judaism rejects Jesus Christ the same as Islam and I John 2:22 applies. Both sides are wrong.

I have Jewish people in my life I care about but I would not share religious pursuits with them [well unless they were born again] and am witnessing to them I am fortunate they are open to Jesus Christ.

It gets kind of weird, they invite everyone on board nowadays don't they?

Bible Believer said...

Anon, Thanks for informing us there are 5 Calvary Chapel pastors or well ex-pastors on there. I did not know Grace Chapel was a Calvary Chapel and do not know much about some of the names including Steve Berger. So he promoted The Shack? That isn't good. I was even going to read that book to expose it but it was so awful, sometimes God tells me not to even read or look at things, and that one was definitely on the list. I skimmed it and was so aggrieved, couldn't even read it to post about it here.

Bible Believer said...

To Nick above,

I have posted a blog article from elsewhere, that does seem to ask some questions. I have stated I do not endorse everything on that blog nor does my posting the link mean 100% endorsement. I questioned things my self from that blog. I'll let my readers read your side of things, and they can decide for themselves what is going on. God only knows all details.

All I know, and will stand by is, when someone tells me they are leaving a church, goes to warn about it, and then still has Bible conferences with pastors in that church something is not adding up? After I left the RCC I wasn't hanging out with priests.

The connections to Missler are worrisome as well. The link to this upcoming conference has been shared not only on this blog but others, where Roger Oakland and Missler are on the list as speakers.

Haven't the Missler connections gone beyond just an award from the outside? It is those things that people are asking about.

Maybe we will never get all the answers. I just think there is reason for some of the questions. Hey I tell people all the time test what I write here, I am only human. When I post a link or information that does not mean 100% endorsement, I usually remember to write a caveat. Eve the list of links on the side of the blog are for information. Especially today when finding uncompromised ministries is so hard.

But I'll be fair and post your side of things too.

Nick V. said...

Bible Believer:

Thanks for being fair and posting the other side of things. The other side of this matter definitely needs to be heard.

You wrote, "Haven't the Missler connections gone beyond just an award from the outside? It is those things that people are asking about."

First off the people who are asking about this need to ask Roger directly, he is very approachable. To answer what you wrote, according to Roger who has a 30 year track record of contending for the faith, exposing the works of darkness and preaching the gospel at all costs, No. According to the disgruntled blogger that has NO track record of credibility and maliciously attacked Roger by falsely implicating Roger as part of the Missler/CNP/Rome alliance, yes.

As for Roger still speaking at CC's and your question surrounding why... let me give you my perspective.

1st off, I totally understand you not hanging out with the priests after leaving the RCC. But I think Rogers situation is totally different than yours. Rogers responsibility for the last 30 years as a watchman is to alert the church. Yes, Roger is speaking at CC's when at the same time he is speaking against the top leadership of the CC "denomination." Roger is not participating with the people he is directly speaking against. (But if he was given the opportunity to speak at CCCM without getting arrested, my guess is he would take the opportunity in a heart beat to warn the CCCM members regarding their leadership)

I personally think it is a good thing that CC pastors are still inviting Roger to speak the truth and warn people even if he is speaking against the leadership of the "denomination" they are associated with.

In fact recently I believe in the last 1-2 years Roger was a guest speaker at John Higgins' Calvary Chapel Tri-City and John didn't like what Roger was saying and he stopped Roger during his speech and gave Roger the boot. Roger is speaking the truth at all costs and it has costed him much. He has received attack after attack after attack for speaking the truth in love.

Think about this... If you were in a building that was on fire wouldn't a fire alarm be a good thing? Well that appears to be what Roger is doing, he is sounding the alarm to the people who need to hear him most, the people that are in CC's.

Hopefully this helps.

news4themasses said...

Go to John Higgin's site and look at his "other" website, Godly Conferences and you will still find Roger Oakland's speaking engagements there. Go further still to Radio Free Church, you'll find Roger Oakland still listed. KRSS radio 93.5 another one of John Higgin's websites and you will find CHUCK SMITH as well. Better yet, go to UTT and find the links page where Roger still links to Radio Free Church, John Higgin's website. Hmm, odd that they had such a bitter battle that NYE in 2010 yet they still scratch each others back. Unless what you're saying is John Higgins is giving the "appearance of being discerning" and yet is using Roger's information as a cover? But Higgins has Chuck Missler on his website too. Higgins and Missler both have Compass and Steeling the Mind in common (and if you look at Higgins speakers at the Conferences he hosts and organizes you'll see a lot of Compass speakers). Higgins speaks highly of Chuck Smith and never warned his flock about Rick Warren and Chuck Smith at Harvest. In fact I was there following that Harvest '09 at CCTC and Higgins continued to exalt Chuck Smith and Billy Graham from the pulpit. Why do you make excuses for Roger speaking at CC's? It sounds like you're trying to reconcile something that you intuitively know is not right. What Roger is doing by continuing to speak at CC's is give CC's the "appearance of discernment" and warning and is rather stumbling more people to continue to hold out for an even greater fall. To all who stay in the Dove club once they know what is really going on "woe."

Jeremy W. said...

Thanks Nick V. for your replies. I will attest to the fact of Roger speaking at John Higgins Calvary Chapel Tri-City church on December 31,2010. Hearing Roger that night on stage was the first time in four year where I was in complete agreement and was hearing someone speak the truth.

That night it was a memorable night for me. It was clear Roger was speaking what the LORD had put on his heart. The entire time it was weird and seemed John was trying to silence Roger. Possibly right before going on stage was the really big deal that set the tone where there was clear tension that from John.

The tape was never ever released. The story was put out that the tape did not turn out. It did turn out however. Lots of lies were told to demonize Roger shortly after. The lies regarding Roger and the tape was when I first became suspicious of the Calvary Chapel I was attending. In my observation there was a deliberate effort to try and completely destroy Roger and his ministry after that night.

On a side note this blog became a time stamp for me. The reason being that when I left Calvary Chapel on October 31, 2011 it was not a rushed decision over the present issue that was going on. For on June 17, 2011 I had posted here as cid#370 about leaving the church. Thanks for your prayers and God was involved much more then you will ever know.

Bible Believer said...

Thanks for your post news4themasses.

At this point, I'll let my readers make up their own minds about Roger Oakland. I see too many discrepancies at this present point for myself personally. Unless he has broken away from Missler and that one bible conference is no longer on, what are people to think?. I wish the guy no ill and had hoped he was real from the start. Couldn't Roger come here and comment himself?

I do not agree with someone still speaking at CC's to me this is a definite OPEN DOOR to compromise. We ALL have to be careful of this. I even had to leave a SBC, it was so far gone, that I planned to go to just for fellowship via a bible study, the Lord told me to leave. One can be involved in their community, and have friends and surely Roger ended up with many CC friends and I can see him keeping company with them but with *RELIGIOUS INVOLVEMENTS*, that is something else.

The priests wouldn't have me around anyhow.

In fact I told one WHY I was leaving and he did a sermon against me, not using names, but half the church knew.

How does one alert people when they STAY WITHIN the SYSTEM? Why is the SYSTEM allowing him in the door? Those are questions some of us have.

I am not saying someone has to be locked behind closed doors. But what Roger is doing is akin to me still attending Calvary Chapel while running this blog.

Wouldn't that make me a hypocrite?

And trust me, right now going without a church community has had it's sacrifices. I left behind friends even in the CC church I exited from having been there a very short time.

What gets me is Roger is *still invited* to these CCs.

Would some read this blog and invite me to speak at a CC?

LOL let me think about that one....

I would first tell them...


and then say, let's talk outside the church building, if they were a sincere person who wanted to discuss these matters.

Bible Believer said...

You wrote:

"Yes, Roger is speaking at CC's when at the same time he is speaking against the top leadership of the CC "denomination."

Seriously how does that work?

I have been in false churches, I didn't know they were false, I was visiting and NEW, but most of these places, you can't even make a mild criticism of Billy Graham or the Catholic church without the pastor getting upset. Even stating "I am an ex-Catholic, and Praise the Lord for my salvation" gets the phonies riled up enough.

So Roger is still invited to CC churches?

I asked LONG ago, and multiple times on this blog, WHERE ARE ALL THESE DISSENTING CALVARY CHAPEL PASTORS?

Show me ONE publically that has spoken out against Billy Graham, The World Christian Movement, etc.

I just not want vague references to the Emergent movement.

When Roger shows up at a church he says he has left, he is implicitly telling people it is OK to STAY WITHIN CALVARY CHAPEL.

Whatever happened to "COME OUT OF HER"?

I left CC and want to tell people RUN! and Do not LOOK back and by the way I feel that way about a lot of other churches, some of whom I just haven't had time to warn about except in passing. SBC is so far gone and compromised, Assembly of God, false Pente churches. etc.

and if Roger is warning about the Jesuits, and other connections regarding higher Calvary Chapel leadership, isn't that a betrayal of those people in speaking at the very church organization that is betraying them? When they get that DOVE or even *KEEP* that DOVE they are adhering to Calvary Chapel distinctives, and other false teachings. Those people are being dipped in the whole World Christian Movement/Triumphalist-Dominionist/compromised evangelical world LIES and DECEPTIONS just even being in a Calvary Chapel. You don't tell people to stay in a fallen away church.

I doubt he is telling people to LEAVE Calvary Chapel too, while being invited to its churches. I mean you could not do that.

What I do not get is how come I cannot find one Calvary Chapel pastor online or elsewhere warning about Chuck Smith, The World Christian movement, the deception of evangelical churches beyond the vague Emergent stuff, Jesuits etc and supposedly Roger Oakland is invited to their churches to warn about these things? How does that add?

This all reminds me when Hal Lindsey was asked why he was hooked up with an apostate organization like TBN where they have a resident priest, and he made excuses about how he would preach from the gates of hell itself just to get the word out. He later was ousted over the Islam issue

"told WND that he has “no ax to grind” with TBN, saying, “I’ve been happy with my opportunities for ministry at TBN. I’m thankful for the platform TBN gave me. I will speak at the gates of hell as long as they don’t tell me what to say. But it appears that they are now telling me what not to say – so sadly, it’s time to move on.”

I am sorry if Roger has faced censureship in some of the circles. That can be very painful and wish that on no one. Higgins etc but too much doesn't add up to me.

New4themasses has added other questions and points too I agree with.

Bible Believer said...

News4themasses points out

"Why do you make excuses for Roger speaking at CC's? It sounds like you're trying to reconcile something that you intuitively know is not right. What Roger is doing by continuing to speak at CC's is give CC's the "appearance of discernment" and warning and is rather stumbling more people to continue to hold out for an even greater fall. To all who stay in the Dove club once they know what is really going on "woe.""

I think it steps up stumbling for people too.

It gives the message, it is ok to STAY within the SYSTEM, even a system they know from the top is rotten.

When I found out the Pope was false, I got out of the RCC.

Shouldn't someone when they find out Chuck Smith is false and the top leadership is fully involved in the ecumenical movement

Get out too?

Even if one of those supposedly dissenting Calvary Chapel pastors exist, by sitting there and not detaching their churches from the SYSTEM too, they are betraying the people in the pews too.

You can't tell someone "Hey I am going to warn you about the one world religion and then tell them in the next breath to stay in a church system that is serving the interests of Rome and deception!"

[Actually most of them are now, just keep that video in your mind that I posted of the leaders of denominations bowing before the Pope] Chuck Smith wasn't there bowing but Roger knows and has warned about the JESUIT INVOLVEMENTS.

It is a major DISCREPANCY.

Anonymous said...

Re: Nick V.
Nice try. The problem with infiltrators, is that they eventually slip up. Their "cover" is to be "credible", but since it is a "false way", there are cracks in the facade, and it all eventually, comes crumbling down. We all know and understand here the tactics of "controlled opposition"; as well as having the guilty parties look like "victims" of circumstance or ploys; whatever. We can all fall into something unaware, but after exposing all he had, don't we think that Roger would have been giving a second look at those he has been affiliated with? If he's discerning, I mean. The truth is, for a man having "faithfully" ministered for over 30 years, Roger dropped the ball big time. Such a scholar and certainly so "discerning" and concerned with "warning", and having been enraged over the rotten roots and fruits of Calvary Chapel, when he was presented with the truth about Chuck Missler, shouldn't he have been equally enraged and eager to warn the flock? NO - he was SILENT. There are others who gave that info to Roger. (see the recent post by Discerning the World, Discerning Africa's site about Chuck Missler and read the comments) He was so busy speaking and "ministering to widows and orphans", but had the time to blog daily about his exploits; he knew that story broke and he could have linked to it; it was important for the welfare of the flock. And still Roger remains SILENT. Could it be, that Roger could only expose so much? That expose' snowball was rolling downhill, and by exposing Chuck, he would eventually be found out? Roger exposes and warns at "all costs"? I think not! It's all in the "game"; and "we" are their pawns? I think not!

Re: Grace Chapel - check out their bookstore here - sorry you'll have to type it in - I didn't know how to attach a hyperlink here - it's worth the effort!

Bible Believer said...

I went to the link of Anon Above just now..!!!!

You have got to be kidding me.

Grace Chapel is a Calvary Chapel and they are selling JESUIT BOOKS at their GRACE CHAPEL RESOURCE CENTER>

Not to warn about...

but you'll see FROM THE FIRST PAGE...

[there is a second and third]

Sort By

1 2 3
The Jesuit Guide to Almost Everything: A Spirituality for Real Life

By: Martin, James

St. Ignatius Loyola (1491-1556), the founder of the Society of Jesus (aka th ... more $26.99 Regular Price
$23.75 Our Price
Online Stock: 172

A Jesuit Off-Broadway: Behind the Scenes with Faith, Doubt, Forgiveness, and More

By: Martin, James
Can we believe the Bible? Does hell exist? What is sin? A Jesuit Off-Broadway pr ... more $14.95 Regular Price
$13.16 Our Price
Online Stock: 39

Praying with the Jesuits: Finding God in All Things

By: Healey, Charles J., Sj
Martin, James, Sj
A Jesuit priest and teacher presents a rich treasury of materials for prayer and ... more
$10.95 Regular Price
$9.64 Our Price
Online Stock: 40

The Jesuit Guide to (Almost) Everything: A Spirituality for Real Life

By: Martin, James
$14.99 Regular Price
$13.19 Our Price
Online Stock: 0

The Jesuit Missionaries to North America: Spiritual Writings and Biographical Sketches

By: Roustang, Franois
Renelle, Sister M.
The story of the early Jesuit missionaries who arrived in North America between ... more $17.95 Regular Price
$15.80 Our Price
Online Stock: 2

Sacred Space: The Prayer Book 2007

By: Jesuit Communication Centre, Ireland
Paperback $14.95 Regular Price
$13.16 Our Price
Online Stock: 0

Sacred Space for Lent 2007

By: Jesuit Communication Centre
Discover the richness of the distinctive prayer method that has made Sacred Spac ... more $2.25 Regular Price
$1.98 Our Price
Online Stock: 0

Sacred Space: The Prayer Book

By: Jesuit Communication Centre, Ireland
Paperback $14.95 Regular Price
$13.16 Our Price
Online Stock: 0

The Jesuits and Education: The Society's Teaching Principles and Practice, Especially in Secondary Education in the United States

By: McGucken, William J.
Paperback $35.20 Our Price
Online Stock: 0

A Dwelling Place

By: St Louis Jesuit
Media: Compact Disc $17.00 Regular Price
$14.96 Our Price
Online Stock: 0

Your search for jesuit found 29 items

Bible Believer said...

Anonymous said...

No one has mentioned the fact that Oakland and Missler SHARE a common board member. Nick, what do you do with that? You are obviously underinformed about Missler's false teaching. Oakland and Missler are joined at the hip and those researchers who have dug into this have found this out. Check out News4theMasses for a comprehensive accounting. There is no agenda of hate, only a search for the truth.

Nick, also, Matt 18 does not apply to public ministries.

Anonymous said...

The Blog author posted a documented response to Nick V on his site -

Anonymous said...

A clarification on the link provided; online book outlets are used by many churches and many of the books are not endorsed by the church. Granted they should make some kind of disclaimer, but if you do a search for "good" authors you will find their books there. The online bookstore here is located in North Carolina and is not the bookstore of the church. Leaping to dead ends is not helpful.

What is interesting is that Grace Chapel is a "closet" Calvary Chapel - affiliated but no dove or outward evidence. The pastor has written a book that has raised concerns about speaking with the dead. Now that is a legimate concern.

Anonymous said...

BTW...Ephesians511 blog wrote a response to Nick V. above...check it out! AND I am the Anon above...

AND do I need to include correspondence I've had with "approachable" Roger, and gotten NO RESPONSE TO? Actually, no...the facts speak for themselves!

I have been grieved by this whole thing. By reading Roger's "Faith Undone" just over 2 years ago, God used him and that work to open my eyes to the Rick Warren deception, that I had been swept into at a previous church...I've prayed fervently for that man - through all his persecutions, illnesses and his "strong stand"...I've been very sadly disappointed and heartsick! But they are falling like dominoes - aren't they?

Because of him, I started researching everything, and everybody in the "Christian" realm. I never researched Roger...he was "trustworthy" to me...the only thing that clued me in to his part in this mess was one question...if Roger is a "faithful watchman" - why does he not address the Chuck Missler info, and why does he CONTINUE to remain SILENT?

The reason "wolves in sheep's clothing" are able to fool us until the Lord reveals the truth to us is this..."wolves in sheep's clothing" LOOK like us, and they SOUND like us...but they are not SHEEP...and one must do a careful examination to discover such. And here's a thought to consider...when you find a wolf - remember this...wolves travel in packs!

Think about this one. "Jesus answered them, Have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you is a devil?" (Jn. 6:70)

And this, "When Jesus had thus said, he was troubled in spirit, and testified, and said, Verily, verily, I say unto you, that one of you shall betray me. Then the disciples looked one on another, doubting of whom he spake. Now there was leaning on Jesus' bosom one of his disciples, whom Jesus loved. Simon Peter therefore beckoned to him, that he should ask who it should be of whom he spake.He then lying on Jesus; breast saith unto him, Lord, who is it? Jesus answered, He it is, to whom I shall give a sop, when i have dipped it. And when he had dipped the sop, he gave it to Judas Iscariot, the son of Simon. And after the sop Satan entered into him. Then said Jesus unto him, That thou doest, do quickly. Now no man at the table knew for what intent he spake this unto him. ..." (John 13:21-28 - continue the reading to v.29)

THEY DIDN'T GET IT...even tho Jesus told them exactly...they NEVER guessed...we would have to ask ourselves...


Anonymous said...

Hey BB...good you copied those titles...
as far as the above address...
January 10, 2012 6:20 AM

it is now 12:54 EST and that site is DOWN...hmm

Anonymous said...

Here's another nugget to be found at Grace Chapel,

Here you will find Mark Bright - Executive Pastor - son of Bill Bright - (founder Campus Crusade for Christ - oh that's right, now they're "Cru"; disciple of Henrietta Mears - "mother of new evangelicalism" "Christian mystic"; member CNP/Dominionist) AND son-in-law of Chuck Missler - and we know who he is.

Yes, that's the church with the Jesuit books,
and the Senior Pastor who talks to dead people (demons) - Steve Berger! Clearly no Biblical understanding or discernment there!

reaching4truth said...

Wow. That about says it all... There may have been some room for doubt earlier, but not anymore.

Roger's silence is deafening.

The facts speak for themselves.

The Jesuits have infiltrated the churches, and CCs are prime territory. Not a single recognizable voice from within heard calling out an alarm or warning. Just little voices on the sidelines, largely unnoticed. Silent complicity on the parts of everyone else.

I know all I need to know now.

I'm out.

Bible Believer said...

So many of them have a common board member. That was Rod Madsen right that Anon is mentioning, the one held in common by Missler and Oakland?

That is one thing doing this research is finding out all these guys are so intertwined its, mind blowing, you see the same names end up all over the place.

Like Greg Laurie being on Billy Graham's board of directors.

Yes New4themasses has more articles too.

I don't hate anyone, everyone wanted these guys to be TRUE. It is a disappointment, never fun to find these things out.

Bible Believer said...

" A clarification on the link provided; online book outlets are used by many churches and many of the books are not endorsed by the church. Granted they should make some kind of disclaimer, but if you do a search for "good" authors you will find their books there. "

I didn't see a disclaimer, if there is one, please post it.

What I want to know is why the Mormon religion brings up books that expose it and Jesuit stuff brings up the complete opposite.

Search on Pope:

There are 9 pages:

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 | Next 10 >
Theology of the Body for Beginners: A Basic Introductin to Pope John Paul II's Sexual Revolutin

By: West, Christopher

I am trying to figure out if this is hooked into a GENERAL CHRISTIAN RETAIL WEBSIE.

and if it's the church bookstore or not.

Bible Believer said...

We know the Christian retail bookstores are well pretty far gone with the Catholic stuff.

Always weird how they expose Mormonism in evangelical bookstores but then have the Catholic and Pope books galore.

Bible Believer said...

Hey Anon, glad you pointed that out. We need check even what we are seeing to make sure we are correct. Still it was unsettling to see the Jesuit books galore. They need a disclaimer on that website, maybe I just missed it. I think its a general merchandise Christian retail of some sort too....I don't think even that church has 9 pages worth of Pope books in stock...

Bible Believer said...

Now Anon what is this stuff about that Calvary Chapel pastor and speaking to the dead?

I haven't heard about that.

"The story of Have Heart was born out of immense personal and family tragedy. In August of 2009, weeks before he was to matriculate at the University of Tennessee, Pastor Steve and Sarah Berger’s nineteen-year old son Josiah was fatally injured in a one car accident. Have Heart relates how the parents, family and friends are coping with his death, an ongoing story intended to comfort others who have or are facing similar life tragedies. As the book’s subtitle indicates, one aspect of “bridging the gulf between heaven and earth” involves reports that after he died, Josiah communicated with family and friends from Heaven.

This book is one of the latest among popular books being published for evangelical audiences on the subject of the afterlife involving visitations to and from Heaven and the connection between the living and the dead. Of this genre, this book is one of the most emotionally charged books, and exemplifies how gut-wrenching stories can shut down rational thinking. As the high-intensity story captivates the reader into a feelings-driven state, the book’s contents subtly facilitate a change in worldview as it suggests novel interpretations of Scripture.

Previously, I reviewed a book in this same genre, The Shack by Wm. Paul Young, which evoked similarly strong emotions with its storyline, subtly disarming readers, thereby enabling the author to introduce new concepts about the nature of God, the Trinity, salvation, spirituality and the cosmic reality in which we live, move and have our being.[1]"

Oh no....


I talked to some many deceived Catholics who had demons in the house they thought were dead relatives [they usually were Marian Catholics who have kicked open the door to familiar spirits]

This is not good, not good at all.

Bible Believer said...

So Mark Bright is the son of BIll Bright? Are you sure about that, could be another Bright. Just want to fact check here. Bill Bright's son is married to one of Missler's grown children? Do you have a site for that, as for him being an inlaw, yes I saw the Mark Bright name on Khouse links. This is all very strange. Now I think that blew my mind. I haven't had time to post on Bill Bright but know he was one of the people that brought deception into the churches.

I thought it was weird enough finding out about a Billy Graham grandson working as a Calvary Chapel pastor

Must be hard to get a Calvary Chapel pastor gig if you are just ordinary Joe Smoe from the wrong side of the tracks, they all seem to know each other.

I find the silence deafening too.

I know when I figured things out, I was out too. For me it was having the pastor preach that direct witnessing was offensive, and back then was finding out the Billy Graham links.

Anonymous said...

Missler endorses Necromancy

Deuteronomy 18:9-12(KJV)

9 When thou art come into the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee, thou shalt not learn to do after the abominations of those nations.

10 There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, or an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch.

11 Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer.

12 For all that do these things are an abomination unto the LORD: and because of these abominations the LORD thy God doth drive them out from before thee."

This is an abomination but somehow it's OK with Ron Matsen, Roger Oakland, and everyone else that endorses Missler.

This IS the apostasy.

For Roger Oakland - "One can't expose the apostasy when one is IN apostasy"

The last days apostasy is tied to 2 Thessalonians 2:10 -

"...because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved."

They didn't LOVE the TRUTH.

The may like the truth, may talk about the truth, may even write about the truth - but the don't LOVE the Truth to the point of submitting The Truth.

Using an example of apostasy with Chuck Missler being OK with being an abomination and his followers as well. It appears Chuck Missler thinks God is an idiot or something.

Anonymous said...

"Have Heart" is the red carpet to "lying signs and wonders"

Anonymous said...

About Avi Lipkin.

Look, the guy always discloses he has an Egyptian wife who works for the Massad, or some other Israeli Intelligence agency, interpreting Arabic periodicals.
Avi tours the country every year speaking at various Christians churches, is it not CLEAR that he too is a Massad asset???
I thought is was an unspoken assumption that everyone knew.


news4themasses said...

Avi Lipkin is a Compass speaker. Avi Lipkin is not a Messianic Jew and makes that clear when he speaks. He's been to Calvary Chapel Tri-City a few times and other CC prophecy conferences, most times without disclousre. Roni Simon is another non-believer who is often invited because of his "intel." Another like this is a Messianic believer but called out to speak for his "intel," Amir Tsarfati. Amir is a close friend of Jack Hibbs and speaks there often. Missler, Hocking, Prasch, and Oakland were staples at Prophesy Conferences for years. Since CC has gone heavy on the Dominionist slant they include more politicians and Generals these days. Joel Rosenberg is a Heritage Foundation member and worked for Bibi. Coincidentally speaks with Tim LaHaye (CNP) and General Boykin (Jesuit) and Skip Heitzig (BGEA) everywhere. When a "speaker" comes to your church with BODY GUARDS and registers at the local Holiday Inn under an alias, there's your sign!

Anonymous said...

To Anonymous you said...

"A clarification on the link provided; online book outlets are used by many churches and many of the books are not endorsed by the church. Granted they should make some kind of disclaimer, but if you do a search for "good" authors you will find their books there. The online bookstore here is located in North Carolina and is not the bookstore of the church. Leaping to dead ends is not helpful"

These services allow the churches to pick what books can be sold. Churches that use these outlets have control what's being advertised.

Grace Chapel is allowing Jesuit books to be sold.

There is NO LEAPING to dead ends.

However, selling Jesuit materials is the least of the demonic problems.

Necromancy is an abomination and it resides at Grace Chapel where necromancy endorser, Chuck Missler's son-in-law is "executive" "pastor".

Anonymous said...

The following is a quote I reposted from a response above, in order to make reference to it and address it.

"A clarification on the link provided; online book outlets are used by many churches and many of the books are not endorsed by the church. Granted they should make some kind of disclaimer, but if you do a search for "good" authors you will find their books there. The online bookstore here is located in North Carolina and is not the bookstore of the church. Leaping to dead ends is not helpful.

What is interesting is that Grace Chapel is a "closet" Calvary Chapel - affiliated but no dove or outward evidence. The pastor has written a book that has raised concerns about speaking with the dead. Now that is a legimate concern."

In going to the above-mentioned, Grace Chapel website there was no evidence that it was a service separate from their own ministry there at the church. In fact, the sidebar to the left, contained links specific to that church, with various information being available, such as pastor, location, programs, etc. Nowhere does it indicate this "store" is in N.C. I would like to know how the author "knows" that. I believe the above quote is a diversionary tactic, which threw the focus off the Roger/Missler subject.
What is sold in the bookstore IS a legitimate concern.
I've been keeping an eye on the comments at "Discerning the World, site". Very interesting! Is there no end to the deception? Apparently it is deep and wide; just like the gates that lead to destruction, and too bad, that MANY there be that find that gate, with no shortage of gatekeepers, herding them in with their seared consciences!
BTW: I believe I passed on error when saying Mark Bright was Bill Bright's son; he is not. In further research, all I could find were reports that he was Chuck's son-in-law (for sure documentation) and (grandson of Bill Bright?) possibility, reported on several sites. I have not found documentation of relationship of grandson. If anyone can come up with the facts about this it would be helpful. However, such conjecture is not a stretch, when one considers that Bill Bright and Chuck/Nancy Missler have both been mentored by Henrietta Mears and traveled in the same circles (Fuller Theological Seminary folk, amongst others) - now there is a birthplace of many a heretic! But the evidence is currently not present to support any family connection between Mark and Bill Bright.
Please excuse my error.

Anonymous said...

Hey, when I identified myself as "the anonymous above", I was referring to the "anonymous" post that began...

"Re: Nick V.
Nice try..."

It is clear to see now that many anonymous comments were awaiting moderation ahead of mine; don't want to confuse anyone, or claim responsibility for anyone else's material. Haven't we all had enough of confusion! LOL


Bible Believer said...

Anon, I agree those teachings are of serious concern, hey I have mentioned before Missler and his wife teaching that *not good enough* Christians will be cast into outer darkness. Which just sounded like Purgatory for the millenial kingdom.
Don't even get me started on the pseudo-New Age Quantum Physics or Bible codes stuff.
Yes why do Bible conferences with this guy instead of exposing the false teachings?

I read more about the Have Heart book. I want to look into that more. When ANYONE tells you to seek after the dead, even a LOVED person who has died, those are lies from the gates of hell. The BIble has endless warnings about seeking familiar spirits [ie ones you think you know] demons make use of that stuff. I have warned ghosthunters to their face they are going to have demons attach to them in their search for "ghosts". The Bible speaks of an unbreakable veil between the living and the dead [us humans], ghosts are NOT human and I believe are demons.

Thanks other Anon for information on Avi Lipkin, will have to do my own search, but guess nothing surprises me given the parade of generals, military folks and those from the "intelligence" community. I mean Calvary Chapel doesn't even try to hide their involvement with the non-Christian movers and shakers of the world. Remember when I did this post? I mean when you got the prime minister of Israel coming over to pay a visit at one of the biggest Calvary Chapels out there, that says something, does it not?

As I have said regarding Israel before. if our USA politicians are SELLING US OUT, on both sides, why wouldn't that apply to Israel and the Jewish people?

Bible Believer said...

New4themasses thanks for posting your info too. Yes it is a regular world power fest, with all those involved and it's all about march stepping evangelicals into the NWO agenda via Christian Zionism and other deceptions. Yeah if your "speaker" needs body guards, something is very very wrong.

Bible Believer said...

To other anon, thanks for clarifying, the online bookstore thing too, but you are right, they are ALLOWING Jesuit books to be sold. Oh and the NINE pages of books, celebrating the Pope too.

Christian bookstores are the worse, I haven't seen one yet that doesn't have a big CATHOLIC section.

One thing, I'll write here so people know, I have serious concerns about Discerning the World. I was threatened with banning, and I was under the bible believer name over there, for pointing out errors in Bible translations like NIV and questioning Pre-Trib. I use the KJV, am NOT a Ruckmanite but accept there is tons of errors and changes in other bible versions. I found it odd, that the people running that website wanted me gone so fast. It seemed I was in agreement with some things, so it was all very strange.

Yes I try to check everything, being human can make mistakes. Is Mark Bright related to Bill Bright? He could be but without documentation, we do not want to make mistake if he just happens to be another person with the name Bright. I do not think the possibility is impossible not at all given how the "network" operates.

Yes there are a lot of anons here. Guess I try to keep track of it best I can. I understand why people stay anonymous though which is why I allowed anonymous posting.

Nick V. said...


Part 1

First off, I never denied, but rather agreed with the blatant facts regarding Chuck Missler, he has been deceived and has been deceiving others for quite some time now. As for Ron Masten I totally agree that his ties to Missler are very strong, he is definitely a bridge between Oakland and Missler and now Masten needs to be questioned. As for Oakland's relationship to Missler, I stated, according to Roger they were basically cordial until Missler called up Oakland after the Oakland/CCCM split. (My take based on the limited info I have is that Missler knew exactly what he was doing when he called to "recruit" Roger off the rebound. Missler saw how Roger was exposing everybody and probably thought somewhere down the line he would be next, so it would be better to get Roger on his side before Roger would expose him)

Please now let me clarify why I think the original blog entry was a "slanderous attack." My take on it is... the information and research for the original blog entry was outstanding, my problem and critique was with how the information was presented and used. Instead of exposing Missler and questioning Ron Masten the information was used and presented in a manner to harm Oakland. According to Roger, the blog author tried to extort him by making Roger publish the content exposing Missler on the UTT site or if not the blog author would take the info on Missler and use it to "expose" Roger. Roger told the blog author to publish it himself on his own site and to talk directly to Missler. In the blog the author went to the extent of making a picture by linking together face shots of the Pope, Rick Warren, William Welty, Skip Heitzig, Ergun Caner, Tim Lahaye, Justo Lacunza-Balda, Chuck Smith, Chuck Missler and then put Roger's picture in the middle. This blog entry was slanderous because it implied Roger to voluntarily being in alliance to the Pope. According to the blog author in a recent blog entry, he states that according to Jude 23, [he is trying to pull Roger out of the fire to rescue him because he loves him.] I' not questioning the authors sincereity but I don't see the love, I don't see any grace in how he is handling the situation; instead to me it looks more like condemnation and a personal attack on Roger's character. You can't take a lower shot at a person like Roger than by putting his picture next with the Pope. I imagine Roger probably took offense to it and it pushed Roger further away from coming to grips to accepting the true facts about Missler and question Masten's involvemnet with Missler.

Nick V. said...

Part 2

Yes, the bibles says "faithful are the wounds of a friend" but I won't consider these false allegations made against Roger "wounds of a friend." Currently in the bloggers latest blog entry titled Roger Oakland: an enigma in the last days, the author is now going as far as accusing Roger Oakland of either being a Jesuit who has taken the Jesuit oath or just a "hypocrite in danger of a place where there is weeping an gnashing of teeth." (I couldn't help to laugh at the absurdity, but in all seriousness this is how this blogger is "attempting to pull Roger out of the fire and rescue him") I don't know this blogger personally, I am aware he did some great research on exposing Jerry Boykin, I regard him as a brother in Christ, but I think he is being very heavy handed and doesn't understand that these absurd accusations are slandering Rogers reputation. I don't see how accusing Roger of being either a Jesuit or a hypocrite is going to help Roger to come to grips with the facts.

To all the people following the entire story... even though I am not on the inside, to me it seems that Roger's situation is way more complicated than just calling out Chuck Missler. Roger's situation needs some serious prayer, not slander or gossip. There is a lot at stake, I am NOT saying that Roger doesn't need to confront these issues with Missler because he SHOULD. I would like to see Roger make a statement to clarify his position. I am saying the situation is delicate and requires prayer and is not something not to be rushed into or forced into by the blog author or anybody else. Exposing Missler and confronting Masten could damage the entire UTT ministry, think about the Myanmar orphanage and the Kenya project. Roger is really going to have to seek and trust the Lord on this.

As for the end results, I think everyone can see the facts lined up against Missler. I am sure all of us highly esteem Roger for his faithful ministry to the Lord and the many positive impacts he has made on us. I am sure we all want to see Roger come to grips with the facts sooner THAN later and trust in the Lord on this matter. We hope Roger will do what Roger has done his entire ministry (by the power of the Holy Spirit) and confront Missler at all costs or atleast make a statement regarding his position on Missler. We need to support Roger through this time rather than attack him or rush him. Brothers and sisters, we need to pray!

May God bless!

Bible Believer said...

As I have written my readers will have to make up their minds about Roger Oakland. I for one, have made the decision to part ways, but my trust of any named preachers/teachers was low long ago. At this point in time, realizing the "networked" nature of Calvary Chapel, I want nothing to do with any of it's affiliated ministries even ones that have stated they have left the church but still participate with its teachers, pastors and related conferences.

I have already written my questions about the blog being addressed above.

There is nothing wrong with confronting teachers on their affiliations, etc. People have done it with me. I have had people ask "Hey why do you have so and so links on your blog?" Go ahead and ask. Right now I refuse 100% endorsement of any place. That may seem extreme to some, but read my "controlled opposition" article and you'll see why.

Only trust in God 100% and take information where you can get it and test by His Word.

As for Roger's sincerity, well, there are many questions that have NOT been answered. That's all I'll leave it at. I just do not know anymore then what I have seen and questioned. Does Roger O know that Missler is false? Is he too worried to break away? I suppose only God knows all the ins and outs there but some of the questions raised ARE FACTUAL, why is Roger Oakland doing that Bible conference with Missler? Why is Roger Oakland still working with so and so?

Prayer is always needed for everyone.

I do have to take issue with one point made above. Anon wrote:

"Exposing Missler and confronting Masten could damage the entire UTT ministry, think about the Myanmar orphanage and the Kenya project"

One does not stay silent about a false teacher to "protect" ministries, if anything being tied to false teachings, doctrines, etc would harm those ministries. It is not easy for ANYONE to expose false teachers. I understand myself the "courage" issues and the "fears" in doing so, but this is no excuse. Of course we should pray for all to have courage in the Lord. Even considering Missler's Swansat involvements with Africa...well you know what I am driving at....

Bible Believer said...

Correction above..."Nick V wrote"...instead of anon wrote

Deborah (Discerning the World said...

BibleBeliever said "One thing, I'll write here so people know, I have serious concerns about Discerning the World. I was threatened with banning, and I was under the bible believer name over there, for pointing out errors in Bible translations like NIV and questioning Pre-Trib. I use the KJV, am NOT a Ruckmanite but accept there is tons of errors and changes in other bible versions. I found it odd, that the people running that website wanted me gone so fast. It seemed I was in agreement with some things, so it was all very strange. "

I said: I never banned you for being kjv only. Who cares for KJV only people. I surely don’t? I banned you for insulting me and saying that ‘our Spirits are not the same’ because I am pretrib and you are postrib. I banned you because you were running amok on my blog posting stuff all over the place, and I could not keep up with what you were saying and I could not put up with a specific insult...

When I asked you over and over and over again what you meant by, “well, we definitely do have a different spirit!!!” you refused to answer. My answer to that was, “Yes, I have the Holy Spirit, I am not sure what spirit you have.”

I then told you nicely that if she did not stop your nonsense I was going to ban you from my website, which I did because you would not stop going on and on about how wrong I was and how right you were in relations to pre/post-trib. So I banned you.

You then said you were going to write an article about me on your blog about how mean and nasty I was, and I told you to go ahead. Which you did. Yay for you.

For the sake of THIS INFORMATION (Chuck Missler etc) - 'Your spirit' will just have to put up with me posting your link on my website :) But if you hate me that much, just say the word and I will take it down, no loss to me.

Bible Believer said...

I believe Burning Lamp over on your website is a "change agent". Even his playing games and trying to say that my blog 'dealt" with too many dark things, seemed to be the usual neo-evangelical script to silence Christians warning. I stood up to him, and would do it again. Now I know this opinion may not be welcomed but will just come out and say it. I have dealt with too many of his kind on message boards. Even if he is sincere he is too intent and busy controlling the flow of conversation [if he is still there posting] and that is a problem.

This fits anyone who tells you to be quiet and not talk about certain things...

Keep reading have more to say...

Bible Believer said...

I am a veteran of Christian message boards, [LOL veteran, is almost the right word considering how far they are gone] and I can tell when someone is working to silence information you are handing out.

By the way what do you mean by writing "posting stuff all over the place"? Why wouldn't I? My entire blog is "posting stuff all over the place". LOL Some have asked me how I get all this writing done, trust me sometimes it is NOT easy, and there is a LOT I have not covered and wish I had the time for or go more indepth on.

I found your blog posts INTERESTING which should be taken as the compliment it is meant as. In fact when I found your website, remember being pleased by it!

So all the anger, and derision just seemed very very strange....

I have been through too much online to not just call it as I see it. The level of anger thrown at me when I was so new to your website, to me seemed very strange and given that most of the debate was with this other poster. I have been on Constance Cumbey's blog and had the pile-up games to divert, deny and deflect my posts, so I am quite familiar with how it is done.

I do not know if you were a innocent bystander or merely had a bad day, but the room given for Burning Lamp and others to advance neo-evangelical responses, was a bit much. In fact I remember being very shocked, that my posts were not supported, and that everything was done to drive me away. Maybe the problem did not rest with you, but other posters, that I can accept. By the way, I have had "change agents" show up here. One has to control them from abusing and seeking to silence sincere and other posters. This is why the posts are now under moderation.

Bible Believer said...

By the way when I wrote the script post, I recognize the scripts for what they are. There is a difference too between the merely deceived and those who are too intent, on getting anyone speaking the truth out of there. During message board days, I was banned alone from baptist boards for what I believed about the Roman Catholic church.

So what nonsense did I "do"? Can you be more specific? I do not want to bore people going through the particulars, but I looked up some of those old conversations.

One thing I have noticed on some internet places, is there is almost too much comraderie between posters, like they are so like minded, they automatically disdain the same folks. When one sees the Pile-Up it does make one wonder.

Why would someone being non-Pre Trib upset you so? I know for a fact some of my responders here still are Pre-Trib, some even disagree with me about a future Pope being the Antichrist, etc. I do not consider these salvation issues or something to silence someone over. You seemed so upset over my non-Pre Trib beliefs even when I wrote that I had recently studied and come to different conclusions.

I don't recall saying I'd write a whole post, maybe warn about my experiences at your website.

It was very strange, and I have to say disappointing. It is hard to realize one's allies are so few. And by the way, I can handle people who disagree with me on minor things but that grace doesn't seem extended the opposite way. But what can I do. I hope you can understand where I am coming from. I do not mind links or information being shown from this blog. Leave it up, and thanks for putting it up there.

I found my experiences strange there, but I am not a grudge holder, just was trying to warn. In fact, I'd rather we can get along better. I do not hate anyone. If you are a sincere person, you will recognize we may have differing opinions on some things, and that will be all it is. I do still stand by the negative discernment I had regarding some of the "information controllers" posting over on your board, but understand since they come over here too.

Try and avoid getting angry at those with differing opinions. I know we all need to work on this, I think because of what I came out of and deception of UU and the RCC, I do not get angry at people but just try and plead my case from the opposite side. I am not perfect and have to step back and be reminded of my own sin as well.

Marion said...

Here are some new developments on the Roger Oakland scenario. Rather than rewriting, I have taken the liberty of reposting my comments from the DTW website - (I believe we are on the same team; commenting on any site or providing links does not constitute an endorsement of any, including G4...we won't find anyone with which we agree on all points, but we can benefit from the information we can glean). The only one with whom we MUST agree, is the Word of God.

31 January, 2012 at 12:03 am
Update on Roger’s withdrawal from the Red River Conference with Chuck Missler; it’s not what I had hoped and prayed for – a “dissociation” and repudiation of Missler, his unbiblical teachings and alliances. Disappointingly, he STILL remains SILENT and those who continue to trust his “faithful” exposure of false religion, false teachers/teaching remain unaware and vulnerable. The one who warned that “certain men have crept in unawares” (Jude 4)…it appears, is actually one of them! It is good to remember that wolves run in “packs”.
Here’s the link:
Jesus said: “I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep. But he that is a hireling, and not the shepherd, whose own the sheep are not, seeth the wolf coming, and leaveth the sheep, and fleeth: and the wolf catcheth them, and scattereth the sheep. The hireling fleeth, because he is a hireling and careth not for the sheep. I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine. As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep.” (John 10:11-15)

there were some comments in-between, to which I responded...

Part 2
31 January, 2012 at 5:08 pm

The saddest part of all this, is the bulk of those who trusted Roger as a faithful guide through apostasy are not wounded by this betrayal…because they don’t know the betrayal happened! (They won’t read about it on Roger’s site, or LIGHTHOUSE TRAILS – they have his books to sell, you know), and that’s their trusted sources for the latest “apostasy new breaks” – isn’t it? They will not know that Roger is hiding behind the skirts of “widows” – that he has been an unfaithful servant (a hireling?). They will read his update and think how wonderful! This deception is further helped along because none of the “big” name “discernment ministries” have covered this either. How many people even know about this website and the few faithful bloggers who have told the truth so that they can take heed? Take a look at all the “discernment/apologetic/worldview ministries” out there. Who has reported this story, which is as big as the Rick Warren expose’ that EVERYBODY jumped on; who “exposes” the false religion of Catholicism and warn constantly of the Jesuits? They are aware this is out there, have been contacted, and remain SILENT…WHY? One reason: so the discerning of God’s people will see…THEIR SILENCE BETRAYS THEM!


But they will sell you their books and their DVDs to make merchandise of you!

The Bible says, “What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin; As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one. Their throat is an open sepulchre; with their tongues they have used deceit; the poison of asps is under their lips: Whose mouth is full of cursing and bitterness: Their feet are swift to shed blood: Destruction and misery are in their ways: And the way of peace they have not known: There is no fear of God before their eyes.” (Romans 3:9-18)

GOD has given us HIS WORD…let us LEARN OF HIM!

Bible Believer said...

Thanks for sharing your comments.

For us Christians, I guess we are seeing what teachers to avoid. I am following the policy if someone is a "known name" even just within certain circles, one needs to be careful. This one was disappointing. You wanted to think someone had actually "broken" away from the system for real. I praise God everyday for getting me away from the Calvary Chapel system, all these developments have just shown it's darkness. Of course sadly, this infiltration has gone on in many other places.

Marion said...

If they are "known" in any circle...because, as you noted, "this infiltration has gone on in many other places"'s EVERYWHERE!

Marion said...

BTW...check out this blog:

Very latest update: It looks like the Red River Conference found themselves another Jesuit to fill their schedule!

Bible Believer said...

Yes I saw that article, quite interesting.

To me that is kind of an "in your face" response to the folks who have warned about these things.

They do not care and I suppose now they realize they can be open and blatant with their involvements with Rome. Most of the sheep have been herded into the ecumenical church already.

If some of those folks go and have a public meeting with the Pope with plenty of photos, nothing would shock me at this point.

As for infiltration, yes it is everywhere, and on multiple layers too as well.

Roy Allen said...

Mrs. Bright and son Brad Bright discuss Dr. Bright's homegoing and their peace and joy. This is only available in Windows Media format.

Bill Bright is survived by his wife Vonette, who assisted him in founding Campus Crusade for Christ; his sister Florence Skinner of Coweta, Okla.; his brother Forest Bright of Hemet, Cal.; his son Zachary, who is pastor of Divine Savior Presbyterian Church in California; and son Brad, who is on staff with Campus Crusade. The Brights have four grandchildren.