Thursday, August 12, 2010

This Picture Freaked Me Out!

Years ago, I participated on the Rapture Ready Forums. It wasn't all bad having discussions with various Christians, though I noticed they didn't want any too heavy discussions of political matters and mods were not happy with me when I said, 'It's not always good for religion and politics to marry" especially in those heady days, of churches jumping on the Republican party or "God's party" Dominionist bandwagon. There were many things I worried about, regarding how Christians, churches and the right wing politicians were joining together. Remember asking questions "What about Bush's Skull and Bones membership"? or "What about the Constitution when it comes to things like the Patriot Act"?

They sure didn't like questions like that.

Remember I see the left wing and right wing working together for deception: let this writer's essay explain.
So while I learned a lot from fellow Christians on Rapture Ready years ago, there was many disconcerting things going on there which this blog exposes too which included defenses of many worldly things.

Oddly many of the Christians seemed to be sincere and saved people while the mods seemed to be coming from outer-space as far as Christianity went and would defend the oddest things. Overall the board was very Pre-Trib and at that time very supportive of mainstream right-wing politics.

I would end moving on to other places. The other day while doing research for my Missler article, I was googling Dave Hunt and Missler for the Missler article and found this odd picture of Missler in "love beads" and Dave Hunt pictured together, [at this particular conference, PreTrib Study Group 2002] many big names are there, including those two and Tim LaHaye]. At this point I decided to go through the different Rapture Ready conferences as pictured: they cover almost a ten year span: after all I had posted on these folk's board before and was curious. Some famous teachers are present at some and not at others. As I looked through the pictures however, a lot did not sit right.

At this particular conference, "Pre-Trib Study Group 2007": the head of Rapture Ready, and other religious notables like John Ankerberg are present and pictured. But what floored me on the "Pre-Trib Study Group 2007" page was this picture:



Here is the caption that appears under this picture:
"It was no secret that Hank Hanegraaff got his head handed to him in the debate. Mile Hile brought this humorous prop to drive the point home."

Is anyone else like me disturbed at world famous pastor's laughing at a decapitated doll's head, that seems marked with occult uses of letters [Hank H's name] and other symbols? What is funny about THAT?

I like jokes and laughter same as many others but this one just totally creeped me out. Considering I have warned people of luciferian deception and "knowing deceivers" what is this a sign of? What ever it is, it isn't good. Even if this was really a bad joke with no further explanation, it seems to be the humor of very worldly people not world renowned pastors who have sought to convince us of their Bible knowledge and spiritual leading.

Other pictures at the various conferences over the years are disturbing as well. Some even seem to mock the Christians they purported to serve with their forum. The world sees many Christians who believe in 'Bible prophecy" as "tin hatters" even those who have not moved into what is considered "conspiracy theory" by the world. . This picture seems to mock all Christians who do believe in Bible Prophecy, why does everything seem like "game" to these folks? Many Christians even on the Rapture Ready boards were asked if they wearing their tin-foil every time they brought up an idea that was not mainstream. I consider the whole "conspiracy theory" phrase in some cases to be a phrase to used to cease independent thinking almost like telling people they are guilty of a 'thought crime"--1984 style but I digress. The Imman caption doesn't help much either.




Even a more recent conferences in 2009, featured "Imperial Storm Troopers from Star Wars" Many people posed with the storm trooper. What are those who warn about the New Age aspects of those movies instructing people to "follow the force" to think? What is the deal with cash boxes covered with crawly characters? Odd jokes about plates with 666 on their plates? OK, I don't want to read too much into the funny hats, even if this brings up thoughts of the Church of the Subgenius kind of humor, I don't share this kind of humor, but it all seems very strange.

It gets even worse then that, I'll let this picture speak for itself. Scroll down to the last one. Make your own judgements. Even an non-Christian believer I showed this particular picture to, said "Now that's disturbing". Christian ministries have enough problems, with those who are in it for the money and legitimate ministries being told they are "money grubbers" due to too many money-hungry TV-evangelists whose desire for wealth is well-known.


But after thinking about all of this, even if some explanations could be come up with for the other photos, that decapitated doll baby head joke being done among world renowned preachers was just too creepy and there's no excuse that will make that sound okay to me. Sorry. The fact that famous preachers were present and in on the joke, just creeps me out even more.


1Th 5:22 Abstain from all appearance of evil.

19 comments:

Lisa Ruby said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Lisa Ruby said...

The caption that appears under the picture of the decapitated doll's head reads as follows:

"It was no secret that Hank Hanegraaff got his head handed to him in the debate. Mile Hile brought this humorous prop to drive the point home."


Thanks for removing my earlier comment. I want to make it very clear what I believe is the real message behind posting a photo of a decapitated baby doll. The beheading of Christians for refusing to go along with the One World Order is what is really being mocked by their posting of this picture on their site.

May your readers research the subject of guillotines and then post some remarks about their intended uses on the Rapture Ready forum and see how quickly they are scornfully mocked by the moderators and/or get banned for warning others about them.

Savannah said...

I left a comment on an earlier article you had posted, but it's not showing up! I'm not sure these are going through...I was trying to dialogue with you. Did I sign up wrong? I guess if you get this- its working! I would love to talk with you more in depth. I have been reading your comments on DTW...Here's hoping this makes it through...

Lisa Ruby said...

You wrote: "Remember asking questions "What about Bush's Skull and Bones membership"? or "What about the Constitution when it comes to things like the Patriot Act"?

They sure didn't like questions like that."

Your remark reminded me that a moderator by the name of Becky closed a thread that was questioning President George W. Bush's membership in Skull and Bones. Anytime anyone tries to address matters outside the bounds of their damage-control-for-the-New-World-Order forum, they would accuse the person of adopting the stance of "I'm a better Christian" than you."

Quite frankly, Skull and Bonesmen serve Satan, not the Lord Jesus Christ.

See the article, "Rapture Ready and the Left Behind Series: Mixes Up Service to God and Service to Satan" for more information about how Rapture Ready mods dealt with the subject of President George W. Bush's membership in the satanic Skull & Bones secret society.

http://libertytothecaptives.net/Rapture_Ready_Left_Behind_mixing.html

Bible Believer said...

Thanks Lisa, yes I think the "beheaded" doll speaks to that. That is something one would expect to see as the decor at a Ozzy Osbourne concert or something not a gathering of "famous supposely Christian preachers. To be honest going through all the pictures, the overall attitude of those running the conferences, seemed to be MOCKING. True believers in Bible prophecy may laugh or tell a few clean jokes, but having the overall attitude be of silliness [for years!] really speaks to something that isn't right. I know those who spoke of a inquistion and coming persecution for Christians were censored. This will happen now on many a Christian board.

Bible Believer said...

Savannah,

I have removed the DTW link from this website, you can come and talk to me here, and if you click on my name, in one of the comments above, you can email me.I would like to talk to you too.

I discerned that something was not right there after talking to the people, who came up with the "basher" script. I know something is not right when people ignore sincere religious viewpoints and start in with the change agent script of someone being a "hater" right from the get-go when you barely have met them and come in with good will glad someone is exposing false teachers. The odd anger regarding their holding to pre-trib beliefs, and me not {a view I recently left, and I do know there are some fellow born again Christians who still hold that view--hoping the Holy Spirit will lead them into truth, also was another unusual thing.

The board on the surface exposing false teachers and one world aspirations looks very good, but yesterday when I saw one of the board leaders regarding the KJV, defending false Bible versions like the NIV {all that research for years and she's never heard of corrupted Bibles?}

So that place no longer smells right to me. Be careful if you post there.

I tried to post this, but do not think my postings are showing up anymore:

"You see, that was not an honest question BL offered me, it was a "SILENCE THIS PERSON" posting. He continued on with the usual "script" that Ive heard from Emergents to neo-evangelicals to knowing internet deceivers, using the word "bashing" for sincerely held religious beliefs.

While I believe there are those who hold to the Rapture, who mean well and are born again, just having not come into the truth yet, I believe the Pre-Trib Rapture is among the top ways, the false teachers out there, are going to deceive millions of Christians, so when WWIII/other hardships happen or they are taking Christians off to the camps, and their easy escape has not happened they will lose faith. Isnt it ironic that just about all of the false teachers you expose on this website are Pre-Trib?

Anyhow Goodbye."

Bible Believer said...

Lisa,

Yes I remember how they would ban anyone who questioned the Bush administration. They had the "thought crime" script down as I mentioned, yelling "you tin hatter/conspiracy theorist" at anyone who said something may not be right here. Right now I wonder if anyone questions Palin or any of that, if that probably will bring a hasty banning.

You are right they used the better Christian then you "script" time and time again to silent anyone with a different opinion. They had other scripts they used to, but that was the top among them. In the world, they do have multiple scripts for Christians, I may do a blog entry on them, among those would be told "you are a basher/hater", "you are too black and white". Any Christian now in the fallen away church who holds to the truths of God's Word too will be labeled a legalist too.

The whole board did ban and close down every thread that did warn of a New World Order and promoted like too many Dominionist churches that idea that the Republican party was "God's Party". The chickens are coming home to roost with leftist Obama holding all the powers that GWB and his power-brokers put in place. Many do not see through the right and left charade, and they have the majority of 'confessing Christians" in the palm of their hands.

Thanks for your article link, I will definitely check it out.

believer in Messiah said...
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Ruth said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Peter said...

That false teachers abound and will continue to flourish is clear and scripturally sound.

However, my message to you from a first time reader of your site is that while you may have a calling from God to expose false teachers, you will waste your chance to do so if you lose your credibility by failing to truly discern spiritually and base your judgment upon your own doctrine, preconceptions and fears, which is what you seem to be doing here.

The innuendo used to assign evil ulterior motives to believers, often based upon nothing more than what seems to be a slightly paranoid interpretation of human beings displaying a sense of humor as they attempt to exercise their imperfect understanding of their own faith is difficult to justify. To say that these pictures are taken out of context is to overstate the obvious.

Casting doubt upon the motives of believers and conveying the implication that they are outright deceivers and puppets in the service of Satan is a very serious undertaking. I trust you appreciate the gravity of your accusations.

As to the question of Truth, I should tell you that this post was in no way helpful to me, but rather it imparted a heavy burden on my heart as I realized that the adversary has sown the seeds of division so deeply among believers.


I can also tell you that as one who is born again with the Spirit of God through the resurrection of Our Lord Jesus Christ, that very same Jesus Christ who is the Son of the Most High God, whom God Himself raised from the dead on the 3rd day, and who sits at the Right Hand of the Father, the accusations you present here have consequences on the hearts and on the stand of Christians who are seeking to know more of God's Plan and walk in His Truth.

At this point I must ask you if you claim to have a perfect understanding of God and His Truth since you seem find it so easy to judge others?

Bible Believer said...

Peter, the Christians in the room, when those folks who got out the decapitated doll-baby head and thought it was a joke, should have stood up and said "I do not think this is appropriate humor". The fact it was even posted on the RR website, was strange too.
Maybe one or two spoke out and were ignored at that conference, but then the posting of the picture online too is worrisome, given surely there was the opportunity for second thoughts or possibility of conviction by the Holy Spirit regarding unwholesome humor.

Peter said...

BB,

Thank you for responding to my comments openly and with respect. I hope that I am reciprocating in a like manner. At any rate, it is my intent.

Since the doll's head seemed to be a representation for you of the spiritual state of the people in question, I would like to address that issue. It seems to be symptomatic of point you are making here.

I can only say that I am very sure that the doll's head joke was not what the Holy Spirit was referring to in Epheseans 4:29. It was not covered with occult figures as one of the posters suggested. The marks were simply supposed to represent the "bruises" the loser sustained in the debate.

While this behavior could be seen as being nerdy and sophomoric, it was certainly not done with any satanic intent. These people are just exhibiting some of the geek mentality that they learned in high school and college. They not perfect beings.

None of us will be perfected until we are transformed in the twinkling of an eye. Ask Jesus, if you don't believe me.

I am not trying to badger you, but I feel that someone should warn you that you are in danger of making the mistake of judging your brothers and sisters in Christ over such trivial points. Christ warned us against that.

Worse than that, you are opening yourself up to the danger of speaking a false witness over them, especially since you seem to completely misinterpret their motives and actions.

That is all I have to say, but I hope you will consider the possibility that perhaps you are not 100% correct in your course.

Lisa Ruby said...

Peter wrote: "if you lose your credibility by failing to truly discern spiritually and base your judgment upon your own doctrine, preconceptions and fears, which is what you seem to be doing here."

This is damage control. I have heard this so many times on forums where I say that so-and-so "Christian" is placing occult/Masonic symbols on his books and teaching occult doctrine in his writings. This remark is identical to those I have heard when exposing false believers.

Peter wrote: "Casting doubt upon the motives of believers and conveying the implication that they are outright deceivers and puppets in the service of Satan is a very serious undertaking. I trust you appreciate the gravity of your accusations."

You'd better believe it. It is a serious undertaking doing what the paid-off-pastors refuse to do: expose the wolves in their own midst. Why is it that the supposed men who have come out of the occult and now serve as ministers in the Christian community never point the finger at the fakes in their own midst? I mean they must surely notice all the devilish markings on the ministries of their pals. But instead, they keep silent and attack anyone who has the courage to stand up and point out the occult markings that are all over the ministries of some.

Bible Believer said...

Peter,

I am a more of a "book-worm" a "nerd" as it were, and I just don't see the "geek" mentality of this at all. If anything the more shy, academic and quiet are lest apt to participate in humor that may embarrass them or others. I see something really dark, that actually reminds me of when I was a unsaved child, indoctrinated into Halloween like my other young friends, and some of those friends had put together a "haunted house" and in trying to make things look as scary and evil as possible they hung up a couple barbie dolls on ropes by the head and popped off the heads of a few others. Now these children watching today's wicked media, reading books about Halloween, didnt know much better, but what about grown bible preachers and others who should, and I don't think it is much to ask them to be up to a higher standard. Could you at least admit "They could have made a better choice, and this was in bad taste"?

The way Hank is written on the doll and the weird little Xs and markings by the mouth, black lines, is just strange. Also the use of a mirrored tray just adds up the occultic look, they managed to outdistance my Halloween practicing little friends on the creepy factor alone.

None of us are perfect but I don't think its too much ask world-renowed bible preachers not to giggle at "tin hatters" and "decapitated doll heads", "plastic spiders" and "666 liscence plates" and other really weird stuff I saw on that website. I wonder why some of the more mature participants didn't ask what gives with all this silly stuff?

You may see this as "trivial" and we may just have to disagree on that, but I see even the humor as very worldly and a mocking type that I would feel very uncomfortable in being around and I believe it would make others feel that way as well. I just can't see a bunch of adult middle-aged and over self confessing Bible teachers, legitimately thinking a decapitated doll's head is that funny even if meant as a trophy in a "debate" win. [Even that is a bit unsettling, the fact they see "winning" as so important instead of just preaching the Word of God]

The fact these pictures were posted without a second thought at all, isn't good either.
Christians are to be "sober" according to the Bible. The world has a lot of that false mocking "mirth". I have the standard that I do not expect Bible conferences to be outfitted Halloween style. [a satanic holiday I fully reject] I do not think that is too much to ask. I didn't even mention the Harry Potter glasses.

Bible Believer said...

Lisa, there are so many ministries using occult symbols and participating in the things of this world. What is scary is how many are even using non-Christian symbols. Halloween is fully accepted and vetted even by some Christian ministries, to the point [as I mentioned above, you get a "bible conference" that is outfitted Halloween style]

Some of the people doing this stuff, have been misled by leaders and others who they are following the example of, but I believe some know exactly what they are doing. Even seeing the guy in the "tin hat" and knowing most Christians who actually believe in Bible Prophecy are told they are "tin-hatters" and told to "go put on the aluminum foil" greatly disturbed me. I believe there are some doing this stuff who know exactly what they are doing and having "fun" mocking those who are not in the "know". The doll-head that outdistanced my Halloween celebrating friends who wanted to make things look evil and scary, just is too much and speaks for itself. I wonder how did they carry it out? To spooky music? "Here we are handing your head to you"? Is this how Christians are supposed to treat each other? "Ha Ha you lost, so now we will mock you?" That bears even another characteristic of a worldy church and pastors who should know better.

Everyone who sat silent during that type of humor, too has the problem in that they should have spoke up for what was right.

When something looks occultic, and evil, no matter the intentions: knowing or unknowing, Christians should speak out against it.

Lisa Ruby said...

Bible Believer wrote: "The doll-head that outdistanced my Halloween celebrating friends who wanted to make things look evil and scary, just is too much and speaks for itself."

It certain does speak for itself! No question about it. In the picture the head appears to be lit up as it sits upon a mirrored platter back ground. It is very creepy indeed.

Lisa Ruby said...

Peter wrote: "None of us will be perfected until we are transformed in the twinkling of an eye. Ask Jesus, if you don't believe me."

This article is not about being perfect. It exposes extremely blatant occult markings on a bible prophecy conference. The Pre-Trib Rapture doctrine espoused by the people who ran this conference was conceived by John Darby who placed many occult markings on his own bible version (See: http://libertytothecaptives.net/darby_version_occult_markings_index.html) and on the "Christ" he was waiting for. (See: http://libertytothecaptives.net/darbychrist_newage.html)

Anonymous said...

BB
it was sad indeed to see how you where treated @ DTW i was very sad to see how you where treated. I no longer comment there either. How can I contact you via email please.

Elmarie

Bible Believer said...

Elmarie, I saw your comment much later, if you lurk here again, please email me.